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Making movies for people to watch at home by themselves, I don't think has nearly the

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impact of getting a group together to have a communal experience.

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This is Just Being Intentional with Thomas Harris.

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My name is Thomas Harris, I'm your host.

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We thank you for being with us, welcome to the show.

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Please be sure to like, subscribe, and follow us, and we will greatly appreciate it.

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My guest for the show is a filmmaker, he's a husband, a father, a fellow believer, and

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a friend.

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He is also the Chief Creative Officer at Kingdom Story Company.

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If you see the background, we've got some posters here.

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This is where we're actually recording today at Kingdom Story Company, Andy Erwin.

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Good to be with you Thomas.

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You're persistent man.

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You kept asking me and my schedule can get squirrely, but I appreciate your persistence

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in making this happen.

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Good to be with you today.

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I can't thank you enough for being here.

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When I decided to do this thing, the show, you were actually the first person I asked to

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come on to get a guest on the show.

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That's awesome.

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I greatly appreciate it.

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Thank you so much for letting us use this space as well.

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This is a beautiful set up you guys have here, and I'm just honored to be here.

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Yeah, man.

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It's an office with a lot of love.

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We make all of our films in this building and from idea all the way to finishing it.

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It's a place of storytellers.

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When you were talking about what you're doing, I was like, man, yeah, let's come over to

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the studio.

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Let's have a conversation.

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Sweet.

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Let's start from the beginning.

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What's the origin story of Andrew and the Erwin?

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Man, we're just a bunch of creative delinquents.

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When we started, this whole thing has been just kind of a hobby as kids that grew out of control.

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I never thought that this would be a career.

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It was just, my dad was in television growing up.

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He was a news anchor in Dallas, and then we moved to Birmingham, Alabama, and he took a

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news director's job there.

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We kind of grew up behind the scenes.

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We were studio rats.

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I remember when I was five years old, four years old sitting off to the side of the set, well,

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my dad did the news.

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We grew up around it.

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My dad got into radio.

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It was radio host for a while.

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Then he had this little side cable access TV show while he did radio.

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My brother was, I was 15, my brother was 12, they needed help at the station.

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We just said, that sounds like fun.

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I think we broke a lot of child labor laws, and we got paid like $10 a day.

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If we ran camera behind the scenes, then we got to use the equipment from midnight till

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4am.

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We would go lock ourselves in the studio and night.

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We're homeschooled, so it kind of gave us a chance to set our own hours.

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This became something we fell in love with, just kind of figure out how to tell stories,

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how to edit and do our thing.

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When I went off to college, there was a small Christian college I went to in upstate New

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York, and they found out that I had some experience with doing film type stuff.

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They said, could you make some short films for the kids?

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They had this camp, the summer camp that they'd have during the summer on this 90-degree

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island in upstate New York, and 500 kids a week would come to this camp.

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It gave us a chance to test out these short films and stuff.

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The first one that we did was this night to the round table, Epic.

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It was like Lord of the Rings, we thought.

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Shot it on little high-age cameras, and it ended live on stage with pyrotechnics.

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It was this epic thing.

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I remember 500 kids in this big meeting room, and we're watching it, and it gets to the end,

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and it's crickets.

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There's no sound at all.

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One kid on the front row, this 12-year-old kid is like, is that it?

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To this day, I can't watch a film that's one of our films at screening in a theater because

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I'm convinced that this guy's going to show back up as a 45-year-old man.

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Is that it?

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It was our testing ground.

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We got to try things and learn how to motivate an audience.

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My brother came home and started this production company just at home in the bedroom of our

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house.

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Then on the weekends, we worked for ESPN at Cameron.

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He got a job as a cameraman for ESPN, and I was like, that's way cooler than what I'm doing.

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I dropped out of school, came home, and we started this company.

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My dad always said, whatever you commit 20 years of your life to, you could be successful

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at.

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We jumped into it.

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I was 21.

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We got into everything from music videos to then eventually trying our hand at feature films.

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Our breakout hit was, I can only imagine, which was 20 years, almost to the day of us starting

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the company.

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God's just allowed us to tell stories for 11.

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Wow.

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So your brother started Kingdom Story Company?

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Well, it started, it started, it wasn't Kingdom.

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We started Kingdom together.

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It started as a little company called HE Productions.

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My dad, Hank Irwin, and my dad got a loan for the equipment, and he had a agreement with

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us if we would work hard to pay off the equipment when we paid it off, he would sign the company

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over to me and my brother.

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So John hadn't quite started it.

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We started it together, but he had planned it out.

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So we started that, that became when we paid it off, that became Irwin Brothers.

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Then Irwin Brothers had a couple of different variations of it over the years.

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Then after I can only imagine, that's where we were like, God, I just kind of really,

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imagine was on the back of a precarious moment in our career where this was either going

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to be a hobby or we were going to quit or it was going to become a career.

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We'd done several movies before that, a lot of music videos, but imagine when we kind of

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went all in on, and when that worked, this little $7 million film it did almost 90 million

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in the box office, we went to Lionsgate, they wanted to start like a long-term deal with us.

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We had always dreamed of having a label and something.

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So our producing partner Kevin Downs and I said, all dreamed of having a place where we

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could.

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So there was a guy named Tony Young that came to us with this idea of what can we do together

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that known as can do apart from each other.

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We stepped in and said, let's start a place where we can fuel other filmmakers' visions.

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So we started Kingdom Story Company.

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Tyler Perry was leaving Lionsgate and we were like, we want Tyler Perry's deal.

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So we hired his attorney, scanning Matt Johnson.

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Didn't know if that was good or bad, but he negotiated the deal we shouldn't have ever had.

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Came to find out later that the rest of his client list was like LeBron James, Oprah Winfrey

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and the Obama's.

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So he had a power list and I guess he either felt sorry for us or believed in what we were

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creating, but we have our deal there at Lionsgate.

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We've been there for six years.

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We just re-up for another three.

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And it's been a great place for us to make movies.

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What would you have to say to that, that heckler from back in the day today?

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First of all, he was right.

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He was right.

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I think every creative or every person that achieves something has to have a villain in

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the story that's that splinter in your mind that drives you towards excellence.

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I watched the documentary last dance and watched it a couple of times.

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And Michael Jordan was really good at always inventing these villains and these scenarios

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in his head.

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So I think that kid was a gift because number one, it motivated us to get better.

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We've kind of adopted a policy that quality is something you always chase.

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It's not something you ever catch.

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You just want to get a little bit better each time.

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And then secondly, we learned to value that person in the front row.

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Who is the person that's consuming your product?

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Why are they buying a ticket for it?

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Why do they care?

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And what gives them an experience that's worth their price of admission?

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So we serve, you know, and I think a lot of times, especially as filmmakers, but it goes

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for writers, it goes for musicians.

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A lot of times it's easy to become indulgent and be like, no, this is myself expression.

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This is what I want to say.

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And you know, the problem with that is they get into a rut where it's like they're

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not valuing the audience.

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And so I think for us, we just began to be like, no, we serve the audience and what do they

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want to consume?

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And so I think if I were to go back to that 12 year old kid, if he showed up as like a grumpy

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old man, I'd be like, man, thank you.

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Thank you for helping us to figure out what to value.

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And I think we've grown a lot in that.

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Yeah, it's you say valuing the audience.

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It's customer service.

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Yes, essentially.

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We're in a service industry.

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Absolutely.

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Right.

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Right.

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You know, I did 15 years of customer service with Trader Joe's and my focus was always looking

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at presentation through the lens of the audience, the customers.

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You know, say if people see a beautiful production or display, they're more likely to buy from

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that, that place because it just looks enticing to them.

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So it's the same thing with movies.

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Absolutely.

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How fun is it to be in this kind of job career with a brother, your brother?

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I remember growing up with my brother, one of my brothers, we as kids, we made our own

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comic books.

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Yeah, we just took playing sheets of white paper and fold them half.

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We staple the size and we just do, we just drew pictures and had captions and it was fun.

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I wish I had those still today, who knows where they are, but just a joy to be involved in

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something with your brother to share those experiences.

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So you developed a passion for filmmaking.

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Was there any particular filmmakers that inspired you early on?

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Man, I think, I think, you know, as any filmmaker, for me, I was backed all thing Spielberg.

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I mean, I think Spielberg is just, he's a master.

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And I think there's a couple of different scenarios.

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And I think with the brother thing, you know, I'm grateful that my brother played a big part

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of my career.

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We motivated each other and John has the ambition and drive that I don't naturally have.

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And so he pushed things for years.

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And so it's been a great ride.

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I think we kind of got to a place in our careers where we wanted to pursue different things.

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And so John's really developing this streaming idea that he's doing with Amazon with the

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Wonder Project.

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And, you know, we kind of got to a place where it's like just because we've come up together,

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it doesn't mean we have to be handcuffed each other.

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And he felt this drive to kind of create new things.

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And John always loves to be kind of on the bleeding edge.

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And I like to sustain things.

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And I don't think either one's right or wrong, but we learn that as we pull in different

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directions, there is this point that's created partners where he comes to a place where like,

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I think we've earned the right to kind of chase our things.

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So you know, John's often re-shootin' stuff for his thing.

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And we're developing a bunch of stuff feature-wise here with Lionsgate.

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And there's things we're partnering on that were projects that will co-produce on at points.

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But you know, I'm grateful for the drive that he brought, you know, for a number of years.

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You know, I think for us as filmmakers, we looked at, there was a group of filmmakers that Spielberg

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was a part of that Francis Forkopola back in the day had this kind of backpack of filmmakers

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that all worked for him.

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And so they started out together and then they became just kind of this loose grouping of

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allies.

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And I think if you go look at Zoidrope and all those guys back in the day, it was fascinating

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this rebel unit that really revolutionized film.

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And they did it through collaboration, they did it through friction with respect.

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But they worked for Francis.

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So Francis said, you know, he was working on Godfather and doing all that.

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But that group of guys, it was George Lucas, it was Spielberg, it was Martin Scorsese, it

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was Brian Dupalma before he did Scarface.

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There was a bunch of them and they would all sit around and just talk about film.

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And the way that they motivated each other and out of that, you know, during a time where

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film had become very indulgent.

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Like the film industry in the 70s had become very indulgent.

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And out of that, that group, I mean, went on to do some of the greatest cinema, you know,

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over the next 25 years.

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And so, but they all started together.

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You know, Spielberg was working on Jaws, you know, George Lucas had just done American graffiti.

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He worked as an assistant editor on Godfather, you know, and then, you know, George started

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working on Star Wars.

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And so he brought Star Wars in to show it to the guys and they screened it for all these

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guys.

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Spielberg was the only one that saw that it was going to be a hit movie.

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And Spielberg was like, oh, that's going to be it.

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That's going to be a hit.

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Nobody else understood it.

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It was rough, the edit was rough, it was slow.

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And it was Brian De Palma that, that in the midst of all that stood up at dinner.

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And he was like, it's like, George, I don't know what the heck I just watched.

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It doesn't make any sense.

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It's like this spaghetti western in space.

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And there's a talking robot.

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And I like it does.

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Who are all these people?

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And why should I care?

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And so in the midst of that, he's like, you know, it should be like the old spaghetti

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westerns where you start with the text at the front of the movie that says, these are all

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who the people are and why they why we should care about them.

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And then George is like, huh, we could do that.

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So the famous scrolling text at the beginning of Star Wars movies came from Brian De Palma

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to Scarface.

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Wow.

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And so, you know, it was this group of guys.

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So I think there's this idea of collaboration of friction with respect.

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And that's kind of what we've tried to emulate it, a kingdom.

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And so I think it goes back to that group of guys that I think were the rebel unit of

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their day.

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Wow.

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That's awesome.

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New information for our audience.

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If you are not a movie buff, I mean, I consider myself a movie buff.

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I love film.

252
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I love the art of storytelling.

253
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The whole production is, you know, what I'm a big fan of.

254
00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:09,640
Speaking of production and projects.

255
00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:13,080
You guys do some pretty good stuff.

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You know, notable projects like the one you mentioned first, the big one was I can only

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imagine.

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You guys have done Woodlawn, American Underdog, Jesus Revolution, ordinary angels.

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And most recently on Sunky Road, which is doing quite well in the box office, took the

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family to see that.

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And it was a huge hit.

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And I was pleasantly surprised, not discounting your talents, you know, but it was way better

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than I thought it was going to be.

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So pleasant surprise.

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And it really shows that you guys are really into your craft.

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And you want to produce quality to present to the audience.

267
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So that just solidifies what you said about, you know, customer appreciation.

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What would be some of those challenges that you face in some of these productions, you

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know, behind the scenes?

270
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Oh man.

271
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Making movies is agonizing at points.

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And it's never easy.

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No movie wants to get made.

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It's really hard to make a really good film.

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But what we found was it's actually almost as hard to make a bad film.

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You know, it's difficult to make a film period.

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So why not push it a little bit harder to try to get it as close to great as you can?

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And so we really, really sweat the process.

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And it's uncomfortable.

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I mean, being on the hot seat as a filmmaker, whether it's, you know, with what they did it

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in the early days at Pixar with Ed Capmo and John Lasseter or what they did back in the

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day with Francis Forekoplin, his group of misfit rebels.

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The idea of pushing for greatness is really, really hard.

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But I think we've got a track record.

285
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And it was funny one of the reviews for ordinary angels that I liked as they said, equality

286
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reviewed faith film from Kingdom.

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What a shock.

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But let's face it, they become the A24 of faith films.

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And that kind of made me smile.

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And I was like, okay, you know, so to have, you know, a movie like ordinary angels that

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John Gunn directed and it be a, you know, to be certified fresh, to be the highest rated

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thing we've ever had with critics, you know, American underdog, very similar.

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We've got a track record of the majority of our films since I can imagine had been, had

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been, uh, fresh, rotten tomatoes.

295
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And I think the thing that I have pride in is when we stepped into the market, the idea

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of faith film, we got laughed at a lot.

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All of us did.

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You know, we had to learn how to really do the craft that none of us really understood

299
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when we stepped into it.

300
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And to invade a weak market where there was not much expected of us, it was hard to get

301
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really good actors in front of the camera.

302
00:19:03,360 --> 00:19:04,360
You're not that good.

303
00:19:04,360 --> 00:19:08,600
We had good, good actors, but get, you know, well-known actors like name actors.

304
00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:09,600
Yeah.

305
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Because nobody really take a chance on us.

306
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So we studied other genres that had done it really well.

307
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And, um, and the genre that we landed on that we learned from the most was horror films.

308
00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:25,360
Back in the day, horror films, similar to like superhero films back in the day, you

309
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know, in the early days of both of those, we're considered like the wasteland.

310
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It was like the cheese.

311
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It was the, you know, this, you're going to be in a cheesy slash or film or a cheesy superhero

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film.

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And, uh, they were kind of a joke and they were kind of where good actors went to die.

314
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But then there was an individual that stepped into that market and said, it's a weak market.

315
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What if we raised the bar?

316
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So you had Jason Blum with Blum House.

317
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Jason stepped into it and was like, well, if we keep the budgets moderate and we push

318
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the quality better.

319
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And we serve these horror fans with a really good product.

320
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As long as you service that, there's a chance every now and then you can do a universal overlay

321
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and have something to say and you have a big breakout moment.

322
00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:15,600
So he did these films that were really interesting, uh, from that standpoint.

323
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And that's where you get a movie like Get Out.

324
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Little four million dollar film, but he took a chance on a comedy writer director in Jordan

325
00:20:22,360 --> 00:20:23,360
Peele.

326
00:20:23,360 --> 00:20:28,640
Uh, they shot it in Alabama, uh, right down the road from where we shot, I still believe.

327
00:20:28,640 --> 00:20:34,400
And this tiny little micro budget film had this universal overlay of, of a civil rights

328
00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:37,600
kind of, you know, social justice kind of message.

329
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:38,600
Right.

330
00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:42,680
But it delivered everything that you want out of a scary movie.

331
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:47,760
And all of a sudden, it blows up and then quiet place comes along and, uh, with Paramount

332
00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:51,040
and kind of steals that same formula and did the same thing.

333
00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:54,640
It was an alien movie, but, but it was really about a dad trying to keep his kids safe and

334
00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:56,680
unsafe world.

335
00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:01,960
And so those films really kind of elevated what you expected out of a thriller.

336
00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:04,800
And as a result, they stopped being cheesy movies.

337
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We're like, well, why can't we do that in faith?

338
00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:13,560
You know, why can't we take what people expect the experience to be and raise the bar and

339
00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:18,200
earn the right to be heard and stop having this entitled chip on our shoulders, Christians

340
00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:22,000
of saying we deserve people to support our films just because of the message.

341
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:24,480
Like, no, it needs to be entertaining.

342
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:26,880
It needs to be worth the price of admission.

343
00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:32,200
And so the exciting thing to see is we've got four films that are cut that have, two of

344
00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:35,360
them have come out, two more coming out this year with Lionsgate.

345
00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:36,480
I didn't direct any of them.

346
00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:38,600
I produced on them.

347
00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:42,880
And the quality is every bit as high as not higher.

348
00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:46,440
And I think the reason why the fingerprints stay the same is there's a creative group

349
00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:51,720
of us that we push and refine and refine and refine to the point of it becoming uncomfortable

350
00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:56,920
at points to try to make it as close to great as we can get each time.

351
00:21:56,920 --> 00:22:02,400
And so to have unsung hero directed by my buddy Joel Smallbone, who's a musician and he's

352
00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:06,760
moved into filmmaking and it's new for him for him to play his father in the film and

353
00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:10,760
co-direct it with Richie Ramsey and the quality to be fantastic.

354
00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:12,080
I'm really proud of that.

355
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:13,080
And so it's been amazing.

356
00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:14,080
It was amazing.

357
00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:25,120
You and I have had conversations about the difficulty of seeing such poor quality that makes it and

358
00:22:25,120 --> 00:22:26,120
makes money.

359
00:22:26,120 --> 00:22:27,120
Sure.

360
00:22:27,120 --> 00:22:32,920
Whether it be writing or directing the whole production is just playing a simple sucks.

361
00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:40,000
And as a fan of film, like I am, like you are to see some of those things actually make

362
00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,520
it and make money.

363
00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:46,560
It's got to be extremely frustrating.

364
00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:52,240
But I want to segue since you brought it up talking about these faith-based projects from

365
00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:54,280
your perspective.

366
00:22:54,280 --> 00:23:00,920
Why do you think it's so difficult for these faith-based films to gain success?

367
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:07,200
You know, the challenges are, I mean there's so many.

368
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:13,040
The challenges for it, multifaceted.

369
00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:18,800
Since COVID, it's become more and more difficult to figure out how to create an event.

370
00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:20,680
People got comfortable watching things at home.

371
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:25,800
And a lot of times what they say is, "Oh, just wait till it comes out on home video and

372
00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:31,960
I'll buy a copy of it on iTunes and Apple TV and watch it then."

373
00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:37,240
The problem is, you know, you significantly impact the amount of product that's going to

374
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,040
get made.

375
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:44,360
And so for us as a filmmaker, we have to create an event that's a reason for people to

376
00:23:44,360 --> 00:23:46,040
get out in theaters.

377
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:50,240
So I mean, you look at like, "Jesus Revolution, that was a great moment for us."

378
00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:52,480
And my brother, McCorkle, directed that film.

379
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:54,480
We were able to create an event around it.

380
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,920
And part of that was God of just what was going on with Aspery and all that.

381
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:01,880
It was a revival that broke out there that we had nothing to do with.

382
00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:03,600
You know, it was a God thing.

383
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:07,960
But it created a communal event where everybody wanted to get out in the theater for the same

384
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:09,160
weekend.

385
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:13,720
So to make a movie work, you've got to get a minimum of a million people out to the movie

386
00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:15,680
theater in a weekend.

387
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:19,600
And you look at any other Christian event that's able to get a million people out of their

388
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:20,600
houses.

389
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:21,600
You know?

390
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:28,000
I mean, that's, you look at that being, you know, the combined total of, you know, every Christian

391
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:33,080
concert for a whole year and one weekend.

392
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:34,080
That's a lot.

393
00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:35,520
So you have to create an event.

394
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:39,600
You know, the thing that we're grateful for is to have a support of a studio that really

395
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:41,200
believes in our audience.

396
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:46,200
So Lionsgate has doubled and tripled down on, we believe in this audience.

397
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:47,760
And they're spending money on it.

398
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:49,840
And that's a big deal.

399
00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:56,280
And then secondly, we're just grateful to have a bunch of friends that have social impact

400
00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:59,040
toward we can really spark grassroots movements.

401
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:03,920
So when it came to like, uh, unsung hero, we got to the opening week.

402
00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:08,400
And we're like, guys, you know, we don't have a big name actor to get on all the tonight's

403
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:09,400
show and all that.

404
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,040
We've got to really spark a movement.

405
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:18,200
And so, you know, it was grateful to have, it was me and Joel Smallbone and Candace Cameron.

406
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,960
We all got together on a text thread and be like, everybody opened up their Rolex.

407
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:26,120
And we've got to go to all of our friends and ask for support.

408
00:25:26,120 --> 00:25:32,840
And it turned into almost a game where, you know, where we just everybody was saying yes.

409
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:34,120
And it was super exciting.

410
00:25:34,120 --> 00:25:36,600
We tallied up that week.

411
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:40,760
How many of our friends posted for us and all their social followers.

412
00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:42,960
And we tallied up the amount of people that posted in.

413
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:45,400
It was 160 million followers.

414
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:50,160
And that's what sparked that in combination with a lot of the efforts that had been done.

415
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,680
It sparked a moment that weekend.

416
00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:54,560
And that's what leads to a hit movie.

417
00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:58,560
And so those are the challenges of getting noticed.

418
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:03,480
The thing that isn't as challenging that I'm grateful for is we're for the first time attracting

419
00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:05,720
really big name talent to the space.

420
00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:09,800
We've got best Christmas page never that Dallas Jenkins was chosen directed.

421
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:14,920
And we were on a call last night at 10 30 at night going through notes on that.

422
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:18,440
And it's got, you know, Lauren Graham in it and Judy Greer.

423
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:21,720
And it's a really great film that comes out in November.

424
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:27,000
And, you know, and it's just exciting to see the talent that's coming to the table that's

425
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:30,760
available that makes these big, big movies work.

426
00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:35,400
And so, and Lionsgate and others are starting now to spend more money on bigger products.

427
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:39,920
So we've got some mainstream films that are in, you know, in the pipeline that I think

428
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:41,240
are going to be really big.

429
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:43,560
Yeah, that's awesome.

430
00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:48,440
Some of those names that you see on the screen, you know, when your movies roll in, it's

431
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:50,800
like, wow, how did it get those guys?

432
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:52,560
How did you get a Hillary Swank?

433
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:53,560
Yeah.

434
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:55,560
You got the guy to play Reacher and T-Reacher.

435
00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:56,560
Yeah, I'll reach it.

436
00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:58,280
You know, it's like, who's literally the biggest dude on the planet?

437
00:26:58,280 --> 00:26:59,280
Yeah.

438
00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:02,720
Yeah, I'm sure he's bigger than life if he's seen it for a huge.

439
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:03,720
Yeah.

440
00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:07,560
So let's transition into balancing roles.

441
00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:08,560
Sure.

442
00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:16,700
The life of a filmmaker is a very busy and rigorous lifestyle, but you are husband and

443
00:27:16,700 --> 00:27:19,880
a father to three kids.

444
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:27,560
And being a writer, a director, producer, you know, chief creative officer at Kingdom

445
00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:36,560
Story, like how do you successfully or attempt to become successful in balancing the life

446
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:39,560
of a family man and then a filmmaker?

447
00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:40,560
Yeah, man.

448
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:41,800
I mean, I think you do it really well.

449
00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:48,680
I've watched it with your kids, you know, particularly with your daughters, I've watched

450
00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:52,360
just, you know, how present and safe they feel.

451
00:27:52,360 --> 00:27:55,800
And I think that's the sign of a really strong dad in the home.

452
00:27:55,800 --> 00:28:01,600
For me, I struggled with it for a long time because I tried to make everybody happy.

453
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:04,840
And I thought my job was to make everybody happy.

454
00:28:04,840 --> 00:28:11,800
And I constantly resented my role and I always felt like it was failing.

455
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:18,440
And there's a man at Lionsgate named Jason Constantine and Jason's.

456
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:24,480
He was in charge of acquisitions for a long time and one of the higher ups in the company

457
00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:27,920
and was one of the people responsible for recruiting us to Lionsgate.

458
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:30,760
But he's a believer and a strong believer.

459
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,720
But you know, it really strong dad.

460
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:37,480
And I've learned more from him about being a father than I have from being a filmmaker.

461
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:42,560
And Constantine would constantly call me, "It's still this day calls me."

462
00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:45,080
It says, "Hey, how are you doing as a dad?

463
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:46,720
How are your kids?"

464
00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:53,280
And I asked him, "I remember we went to Santa McCahn one year right after I can only imagine."

465
00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:55,080
And Santa McCahn, they have in Vegas.

466
00:28:55,080 --> 00:29:02,600
And so Mandy went with me and we were at this table of a bunch of people from Lionsgate.

467
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:04,880
And we went out to dinner at like it was a sushi place.

468
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,200
And it was no boo and so big expensive sushi place.

469
00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:12,040
But I remember I was sitting by Jason and he asked me some of the questions about being a dad.

470
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:17,280
And I finally turned to him and I was like, "Jason, how do you find balance in this job as

471
00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:19,680
a filmmaker and as a dad?"

472
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:20,920
And he looked at me and he didn't blink.

473
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:21,920
He's like, "You don't."

474
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:24,360
And I was a very unbalanced job.

475
00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:27,000
So if you're looking for balance, this isn't the job.

476
00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:28,760
What you will find is seasons.

477
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:33,240
And I was like, "Huh." He's like, "There's seasons where your life is going to be crazy because

478
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:34,800
you got to go make a movie."

479
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:36,000
The same thing as being in the military.

480
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:37,000
Well, not same.

481
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:38,000
It's a lesser.

482
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:40,480
It's very a lot harder for him being military.

483
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,480
But being deployed in military, you're gone for a season.

484
00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:44,840
There's nothing you can do about it.

485
00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:48,120
Like it's your job.

486
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:49,440
But there's seasons where you're home.

487
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:57,560
And he said, "What you find is a lot of guys get so addicted to the adrenaline of being,

488
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:03,440
you know, as a filmmaker deployed on a film, that when they get home, they try to find something

489
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:06,760
to always keep them busy so they're never present at home."

490
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:09,200
He's like, "Don't miss your seasons at home.

491
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:10,800
When you're at home, be home.

492
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:12,120
Be present.

493
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:15,400
Invest in your kids and see them as the priority."

494
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:19,960
So it really gave me permission that there's times where my job is really busy.

495
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:24,080
And when I go to do my job, I work my tail off and I do my job with the best of my ability.

496
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:26,840
I'm fully present doing my job.

497
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:30,880
But then I look for moments to be present when my kids finding ways to do that while I'm

498
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:31,880
doing that.

499
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,440
And then when I get home, I'm home.

500
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:37,240
And finding ways to invest in them.

501
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:42,600
Where they feel seen, they feel safe, they feel the priority, they feel important.

502
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:47,040
My wife, Mandy, you know, she is the rock of our family.

503
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:49,040
I feel like she's the heart.

504
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:54,160
She absolutely gives me strength and we're partners in that.

505
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:56,240
And so we both feel fully committed.

506
00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:00,960
You know, I've told her all along, like if at any point this becomes detrimental to our

507
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:05,320
family and you feel like we're not supposed to do this anymore, you let me know and I give

508
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:07,160
up this job in a heartbeat.

509
00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:09,400
You know, we'll do something else.

510
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,200
But as long as we feel called to this, we've got to be strategic.

511
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:20,080
And she's been my partner in that and helping me to find that way to embrace seasons.

512
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:26,040
And I've found that my job has gotten busier, especially as I stepped into being chief

513
00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:30,240
creative officer because it's like, you know, I'm not just responsible for one film at a

514
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:31,240
time.

515
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,800
I'm responsible for the creative on five films at a time.

516
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:36,320
And so that's a lot.

517
00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:41,040
And so at times I feel like I'm drinking out of a fire hose.

518
00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:47,440
But my life has gotten busier, but I feel like I've been able to learn how to, my family

519
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:50,040
to feel, still feel chosen in that.

520
00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:53,240
So it's not necessarily about being the victim of your schedule.

521
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:55,360
It's about being intentional with your time.

522
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:57,040
And that's what I've been learning.

523
00:31:57,040 --> 00:31:58,040
I'm still learning.

524
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:04,280
Funny thing about coming here from to Tennessee from LA is that I was able to connect with people

525
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:08,200
here that had connections with people back home.

526
00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:10,800
Jason is a great dude.

527
00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:13,200
You know, our families went to church together.

528
00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:18,560
I did a biblical counseling course with his wife.

529
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:20,840
So that was, that was pretty awesome.

530
00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:25,640
Like we said earlier, you know, I've been trying to track you down for this.

531
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:27,360
You're the first person I asked.

532
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:29,600
And we finally made it happen today.

533
00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:37,280
And when we finally locked down a date, we were talking at the kids, Peter Pam play.

534
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,120
And your son made a great captainhood.

535
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:40,120
He was fantastic.

536
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:43,640
Yeah, it was a proud dad moment for sure.

537
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:47,960
But one thing I told you just in relation to what you were just saying about the family

538
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:49,960
dynamic balance.

539
00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:53,240
Andy was sitting next to you as we were speaking about scheduling this.

540
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:56,680
And I said, she is your priority.

541
00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:57,680
I am not.

542
00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:00,040
I say, it's going to happen.

543
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:02,880
I'm faith that it's going to happen when it's supposed to happen.

544
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:06,400
But I don't want you to neglect your wife.

545
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:12,360
And, you know, the free time that you have, I want to respect that, that's family time.

546
00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:16,320
Because I know that you can get on the road and be gone for a period, long periods of time.

547
00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:21,120
So I just wanted to let you know that that's, I fully support that.

548
00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:22,360
I fully support that.

549
00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:24,920
And I'm sure that your wife does as well.

550
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:33,280
So with recent strikes that we had last year, the writer strike, let's talk about some

551
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:37,440
of these struggles with the industry.

552
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:43,920
So what were some of those frustrations that you guys have had with the industry, the

553
00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:45,240
changing trends?

554
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:51,160
You know, I think the bigger issue for us is, you know, the industry as a whole, yeah, I,

555
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:54,040
and I don't know how to solve any of those things.

556
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:57,680
But for us, we're small enough to where we're able to kind of be a little bit more of a

557
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:00,920
delta force and kind of work around the system.

558
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:02,200
And so I'm grateful for that.

559
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:09,360
We kind of are naturally kind of inclined to be rebels, which I like.

560
00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:13,240
You know, I think the biggest challenge is always society as a whole because of where

561
00:34:13,240 --> 00:34:14,240
technology is.

562
00:34:14,240 --> 00:34:16,480
And I think it plays into the AI thing.

563
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,840
I think it plays into the, the COVID of it all.

564
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:26,000
I think that that society as a whole is pulling more and more towards isolation.

565
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:32,280
You know, people would rather have a relationship with their computer than a human being.

566
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:36,960
And you know, that creates challenges for us as an industry.

567
00:34:36,960 --> 00:34:39,720
But I think it's even bigger challenges as a society.

568
00:34:39,720 --> 00:34:43,800
And I think trying to get people to get out of their houses and stay connected together.

569
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,880
And I think it's a fundamental of what we believe is Christians.

570
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:54,640
I mean, I think there's a reason why Paul said don't forsake the assembling of together,

571
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:56,880
as some have grown accustomed to do.

572
00:34:56,880 --> 00:35:02,120
I think as a whole, the enemy loves to pull us into isolation.

573
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:07,880
And the communal aspect of being connected to groups of individuals, I think is a bedrock

574
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:11,840
principle that is needed to have a strong faith.

575
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:17,520
So what I do as a filmmaker is not critical to that equation, but it is a tool.

576
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:24,360
You know, it's a tool to get people out of their houses and to get people connected.

577
00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:29,440
And I think you look at that as, you know, storytelling has always been a form of that

578
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:32,720
throughout human history of sitting around a campfire and sharing stories.

579
00:35:32,720 --> 00:35:34,920
There's a communal aspect of being able to share that.

580
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:38,480
And you look at how that translates today that, you know, a group of us get together.

581
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:41,280
And the first thing to talk about is like, what have you seen lately?

582
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:42,680
Share stories.

583
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:46,920
We just add that extra element of being able to start those conversations about faith and

584
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:49,240
the value of the things.

585
00:35:49,240 --> 00:35:52,680
But it's the challenge is how do we get people out of their houses and get people to stop

586
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:58,120
just being content to have a relationship by themselves with their computer.

587
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:03,640
And AI is just another version of that of just replacing, you know, what is human with

588
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:05,920
something that's artificial.

589
00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:13,360
And I think the artificial is easier because it doesn't require the other side of a relationship.

590
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:15,880
It's messier to have a relationship with a human being.

591
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:19,080
Which also explains why we have self-checkout lines.

592
00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:20,080
Exactly.

593
00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:26,480
It's just we want at least interaction with people as possible because we want, you know,

594
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,840
technology that serves us without asking for anything in return.

595
00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:31,720
But that's not a relationship, right?

596
00:36:31,720 --> 00:36:34,160
You know, that's transactional.

597
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:36,440
And I think we become more and more of a transactional society.

598
00:36:36,440 --> 00:36:38,120
I don't know how to change that.

599
00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:42,520
You know, I really feel like we learned to navigate around it.

600
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:48,840
You know, but I think it's a spiritual condition that is just the nature of the treadmill we've

601
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:49,840
chosen to be on.

602
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:54,400
And I don't think you can really, I don't know how you pull that back.

603
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:58,760
But that is the challenge is people and more and more have relationship with people on

604
00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:01,120
social media and not people in real life.

605
00:37:01,120 --> 00:37:06,360
You know, it's a, it's a, it keeps people at an arm's length distance.

606
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:07,360
And socially awkward.

607
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:08,360
And socially awkward.

608
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:11,560
And so, you know, I think that's a challenge.

609
00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:12,560
That's a real challenge.

610
00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:16,840
And I think it, but I think we were meant to have community.

611
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:19,840
We were meant to have relationships with people.

612
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:27,200
And so that's why we've been so committed, you know, on the kingdom side to the theatrical

613
00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:29,000
experience.

614
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:34,520
Because, you know, making movies for people to watch at home by themselves, I don't think

615
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:39,440
it has nearly the impact of getting a group together to have a communal experience.

616
00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:43,960
There's a difference from listening to music in your car by yourself, which is fine.

617
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:45,280
That's a part of it.

618
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:48,760
There's a different experience when you can go to a praise and worship concert and experience

619
00:37:48,760 --> 00:37:50,840
it as a group.

620
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:54,240
And I think it's a needed part of the human condition is to connect with people.

621
00:37:54,240 --> 00:37:58,800
You know, COVID for a lot of people was a very devastating time.

622
00:37:58,800 --> 00:37:59,800
Yeah.

623
00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:03,720
For me, it was presented as an opportunity.

624
00:38:03,720 --> 00:38:10,040
One of the main motivations that I have for even doing this, what we're doing now was coming

625
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:15,640
out of COVID, you know, in 2020, I was going through all the contacts on my phone and just

626
00:38:15,640 --> 00:38:17,560
calling people and checking on them.

627
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,640
Because people were isolated, like you said.

628
00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:28,400
And getting people to realize that you are being thought of, you know, and rather than

629
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:33,320
just keeping it at, I wonder what someone's so-and-so is up to, I pick up the phone and I call

630
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:35,560
them or just text them.

631
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:40,400
And so many of those conversations were so timely for people because they needed somebody

632
00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:41,880
to reach out.

633
00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:44,040
So I was being intentional with that.

634
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:45,040
That's cool.

635
00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:46,040
And it was an everyday thing.

636
00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:50,280
I was just like, you know, in Los Angeles, you have horrible commutes.

637
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,520
You know, 17 mile commute was hour and a half.

638
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:54,520
It's ridiculous.

639
00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:55,520
It's ridiculous.

640
00:38:55,520 --> 00:39:00,880
So I used that as an opportunity to just get on the phone and start using that time to

641
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:01,880
check in with people.

642
00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:02,880
That's awesome.

643
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:07,120
And it, you know, it was like I was driving in a Tesla on self-drive.

644
00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:08,120
That's cool.

645
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,000
But my vehicle was far from a Tesla.

646
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:20,840
It was a hoop-dee-dope, but the intentionality of that was rewarding for me because I was able

647
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:22,840
to make an impact in people's lives.

648
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:23,840
That's cool.

649
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:27,920
But they were, some of those folks felt like they were forgotten about.

650
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:32,680
Everybody was doing the same thing, isolating, sheltering in place.

651
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:37,400
I was like, no, this is not the way God designed us to be.

652
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:39,720
We were, we were created to be social creatures.

653
00:39:39,720 --> 00:39:43,120
And this is anti-social creatures.

654
00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:50,320
So speaking of being intentional, what is it that you, and you kind of touched on it already,

655
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:55,040
but what is it you need to really do to be more intentional?

656
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:58,920
You know this is what I need to do, but you just got to make it happen.

657
00:39:58,920 --> 00:39:59,920
Yeah.

658
00:39:59,920 --> 00:40:07,400
I mean, I think it goes back to the community idea is, as guys, especially we get so task-oriented

659
00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:13,680
that it's about a checklist and the thing that we're afraid of more than anything is somebody

660
00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:16,040
feeling like we don't know what we're doing.

661
00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:19,640
We want to be competent in people's eyes.

662
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:20,960
And I think we protect that.

663
00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:24,640
And I think it naturally gears towards isolation.

664
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:32,040
It naturally gears towards control and it naturally gears towards being low-wulfs.

665
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:40,400
And I think I've learned from falling on my face enough times that what's required is

666
00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:49,200
being intentionally vulnerable and having a group of men that know me inside now that there

667
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:54,120
is no nothing hidden seeking out individuals like that that are safe.

668
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:59,120
And I think what makes a safe individual like that is I don't believe relationships are

669
00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:02,000
safe unless they go both ways.

670
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:07,640
Like, you know, if it's somebody that's always there to help you and you never help them

671
00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:10,040
and you don't know their stuff, it's not a safe relationship.

672
00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:11,040
It's a therapist.

673
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:13,880
You know, there's nothing wrong with therapists.

674
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:19,440
I have a therapist, but it's a transactional relationship.

675
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:24,640
But a community relationship is somebody that they know your stuff, you know their stuff.

676
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:26,400
They're there to help you, you're there to help them.

677
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:28,400
It's common interest.

678
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:35,040
And, you know, it's hard to find individuals that have that same alignment.

679
00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:40,440
And, you know, on that list, I have, I'd say I have 10 of those people where they know

680
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:42,240
me and I know them.

681
00:41:42,240 --> 00:41:48,440
And then I have maybe four of those people that are, you know, an every week kind of thing.

682
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:51,640
And I've got one or two that are like an everyday thing.

683
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:57,680
And just intentionally, you know, especially the busier life gets, the more you should

684
00:41:57,680 --> 00:41:59,840
be talking to those people.

685
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:00,840
Because it's so easy.

686
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:06,960
I meet too many guys and I potentially been one of those guys at points where you get to

687
00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:11,240
go and so fast and then I'll have said and you do something stupid and you talk to guys

688
00:42:11,240 --> 00:42:12,640
that have really blown up their lives.

689
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:13,640
And like what happened?

690
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:14,640
Like I didn't see it coming.

691
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:15,640
I don't know.

692
00:42:15,640 --> 00:42:16,640
It was just things were crazy.

693
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:20,320
It was busy and all of a sudden boom, you know, my life exploded.

694
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:24,920
And you're like, well, there's warning lights along the way and just pay attention to those

695
00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:25,920
warning lights.

696
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:30,120
And when those warning lights go off of like caution, they're like, I need to talk to somebody.

697
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:38,000
And I think that's really what has, you know, the older I've gotten, the more my mistakes

698
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:43,960
have been painful enough to learn from, the more I've intentionally sought out and maintain

699
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:45,440
those kind of relationships.

700
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:50,240
And you and I have had some of those conversations too because I asked, you know, I was interested

701
00:42:50,240 --> 00:42:52,960
in, you know, we're not just going to talk film.

702
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:53,960
That's not life.

703
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:54,960
Right.

704
00:42:54,960 --> 00:43:00,240
My angle is what's really going on, what is real life.

705
00:43:00,240 --> 00:43:04,320
And that's, especially as men, that's what we need to be to each other.

706
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:08,400
And that's part of the iron sharpening iron is like, you got to get real.

707
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:10,200
Sometimes you got to get raw.

708
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:12,280
You got to get things off your chest.

709
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:15,800
You got to be transparent and vulnerable.

710
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:21,440
You know, my first episode on this show was me being vulnerable.

711
00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:22,440
I can't help it.

712
00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:23,640
It's just how I'm wired.

713
00:43:23,640 --> 00:43:24,640
I love that about you.

714
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:26,640
I'm going to talk.

715
00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:30,160
I'll get into some deep stuff and I'll share some tears.

716
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:35,600
But, you know, I'm comforted by the shortest verse in the Bible, Jesus web.

717
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:42,160
So that gives me full authority to say it's okay to let out shed some tears sometimes.

718
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:43,680
Passion projects coming up.

719
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:46,920
I've got a lot of them.

720
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:48,520
You know, it's exciting.

721
00:43:48,520 --> 00:43:56,760
We've got several that are about to go into production.

722
00:43:56,760 --> 00:44:00,000
You know, we're wrapping up the rest of the films for this year.

723
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:05,320
We've got a project that goes in June that we're doing with Amazon called Sears Oil.

724
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:06,800
It's a fantastic story.

725
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:09,240
Then my buddy, Si, is directing.

726
00:44:09,240 --> 00:44:13,200
I've got a couple of friends that are starring in it.

727
00:44:13,200 --> 00:44:16,120
So Zachary Levi is going to be back in that one.

728
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:20,720
And then Soniko Martin Green, her husband, Kinric, man, these two individuals, I'm fired up

729
00:44:20,720 --> 00:44:21,720
about them.

730
00:44:21,720 --> 00:44:25,200
But she's the star of Star Trek Discovery.

731
00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:31,200
And she's a believer and has been looking for the right opportunity to explore expressing

732
00:44:31,200 --> 00:44:32,680
what she believes.

733
00:44:32,680 --> 00:44:34,680
And so, Sarah's Oil is a period drama.

734
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:38,040
It takes place in Oklahoma about the first black millionaire in the history of the country.

735
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:42,840
It's a little girl named Sarah that they found oil in her land.

736
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:45,200
And her fighting to keep it as the community tried to take it away.

737
00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:46,880
That's a beautiful story.

738
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:49,360
So that one goes in production in June.

739
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:51,920
It's going to be great.

740
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:54,320
And then I've got three that I'm developing to direct.

741
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:55,320
One of those being fearless.

742
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:58,760
The Navy SEAL story that is a passion project that I'm chasing.

743
00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:04,000
So Jason Hall that wrote Americans, snipers writing the script and trying to get that one

744
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:05,000
ready to go.

745
00:45:05,000 --> 00:45:08,600
And then I've got to get, I've got a list, a short list of movie stars that I've got

746
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:11,480
to get one of them on board in order to get the budget that I need.

747
00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:13,480
So that's me to talk to them.

748
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:19,480
I might, I might, I might, and so that one's exciting.

749
00:45:19,480 --> 00:45:23,680
And then I've got a sequel to a film that I'm really excited about that hopefully are going

750
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:29,680
to production in the fall that not quite ready to announce, but it's going to be exciting.

751
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:32,720
And that one's a passion project and it's going to be huge.

752
00:45:32,720 --> 00:45:34,200
So it's going to be really cool.

753
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:36,320
So yeah, we got a bunch of stuff.

754
00:45:36,320 --> 00:45:43,240
And then we're also pitching beloved best selling novel that my buddy is directing that

755
00:45:43,240 --> 00:45:47,080
we're pitching around right now that will be announcing shortly that's going to be earth

756
00:45:47,080 --> 00:45:51,000
shattering when we announce the news, but not quite ready yet.

757
00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:52,800
Yeah, that's exciting stuff.

758
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:55,200
I'm really looking forward to this Navy SEAL story.

759
00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:56,200
Yeah.

760
00:45:56,200 --> 00:45:58,280
Because we've been talking about it for a while.

761
00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:03,960
And I love anything that has, that's war related being a veteran.

762
00:46:03,960 --> 00:46:08,880
It just connects, it connects me that much deeper to our veterans when I, when I hear

763
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:11,360
those stories and I see them on film.

764
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:14,560
So I'm excited for that.

765
00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:21,400
I want to thank you for your time, your insights, your story is greatly appreciated.

766
00:46:21,400 --> 00:46:24,200
And I'm glad we finally made this happen.

767
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:32,640
And I appreciate you as a brother and love your family and continue success to you, sir.

768
00:46:32,640 --> 00:46:33,640
Thanks button.

769
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:34,640
I appreciate you Thomas.

770
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:40,280
I love that your whole podcast being about intentionality forces me to slow down and be intentional

771
00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:41,280
today.

772
00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:42,280
So well done.

773
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:43,800
You're doing something right, but thank you, sir.

774
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:44,800
I appreciate you.

775
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:46,280
God bless you.

776
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:47,440
Yeah, man.

777
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:50,000
Thank you guys for checking in.

778
00:46:50,000 --> 00:46:53,680
This has been just being intentional with Thomas Harris.

779
00:46:53,680 --> 00:46:56,400
Please like, subscribe, follow.

780
00:46:56,400 --> 00:46:58,800
And we appreciate you.

781
00:46:58,800 --> 00:46:59,800
Thank you.

782
00:46:59,800 --> 00:46:59,800
God bless.

783
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:09,800
[Music]

784
00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:19,800
[Music]