1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:11,600 [MUSIC] 2 00:00:11,600 --> 00:00:21,840 The simplest thing I can say about how to manage fear is to believe and accept that the threat that you feel from fear, 3 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:25,040 at least that initial response needs to be challenged. 4 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:28,320 Welcome to the Executive Connect podcast. 5 00:00:29,120 --> 00:00:35,200 Did you know the average person spends four years of their life worrying? 6 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:41,440 Are you one of the many people with high potential that is paralyzed by fear? 7 00:00:41,440 --> 00:00:46,240 Are you ready to take the next step to reach your full potential? 8 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:55,360 Dr. Benjamin, Ritter, specializes in fear and how to harness it to lead us to our best lives. 9 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:56,960 Welcome, Dr. Benjamin. 10 00:00:58,800 --> 00:01:00,480 Thank you so much for having me. 11 00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:08,880 I was just reflecting on how I have not felt fear from a conversation or an interview in a very 12 00:01:08,880 --> 00:01:15,280 long time, especially if it's virtual. But in person, then I got some stories for you. 13 00:01:15,280 --> 00:01:23,920 I love it. Well, that's a great first statement. So tell me from your perspective, 14 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:25,760 what does it mean to be fearless? 15 00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:34,000 To be fearless, maybe that you are not being held back from anything that you actually really want to do. 16 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:38,000 It's about having no limits. It's about never doubting yourself. 17 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:40,960 It's about being able to make the most of situations, 18 00:01:40,960 --> 00:01:44,480 and a little disclaimer. It's not about actually not doubting yourself, 19 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:47,040 but it's not allowing doubt to hold you back from taking action. 20 00:01:47,040 --> 00:01:55,120 And so generally being fearless is that you do what you want to do without being held back by 21 00:01:56,640 --> 00:02:03,280 the unknown or the lack of confidence or just anything in general. You take action. 22 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:12,400 Even when you're really scared, I find you know, you mentioned in person being fearless or being 23 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:17,120 fearful when you're in person. I know when I first had to speak in front of people, I was so scared. 24 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:20,320 I thought I was going to shake and fall off the stage and forget all my words. 25 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:28,560 And so thinking about strategies and how they help bust through fear that one may have, 26 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:36,240 what strategies have you found to be the most effective in managing fear and stepping out of your 27 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:38,480 comfort zone to bust through those fears? 28 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:44,080 So generally interrupting the fear cycle, but I'm going to say something 29 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:51,040 it may or may not resonate with some people yet, but if it doesn't, listen to it again. 30 00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:56,800 So when I would go like maybe speak in person at an event to do it pretty regularly, 31 00:02:56,800 --> 00:03:00,880 and some of them are more important to me than others, and I sometimes get this response. 32 00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:06,960 And I think it was very similar to the response that I got when I went to get surgery for the first 33 00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:12,640 time at the doctor's office. I would just all of a sudden start shaking. My legs would start shaking, 34 00:03:12,640 --> 00:03:18,320 my arms would start shaking. I'd be sitting there and I'm thinking to myself, I don't feel afraid. 35 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:27,760 I don't feel like I'm not going to do this, but my body is responding to the situation that it's in. 36 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:33,520 And I think it's very important to like create a distinction between, is this something you're going to do, 37 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:38,000 but still feel uncomfortable doing it? And your body is just generally going to react to it, 38 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:42,160 because there's certain things we can control and certain things that we can control. We can control 39 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:46,320 if we're taking action and going through something that we think is important to us. We can control 40 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:52,960 at times our physiological responses to fear or to something that we're uncomfortable with. 41 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:58,560 And with exposure and with some other strategies, we generally can like reduce the impact of that fear, 42 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:02,400 but it's important to just at least kind of distinguish between, 43 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:08,240 we can, there are certain things we can't do and certain things that we can't do based on just 44 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:11,200 like working through things with our thoughts and interrupting the fear cycle. 45 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:19,280 So overall fear is a feeling that's, and that's all it is, it's information. It's defined by your thoughts 46 00:04:19,280 --> 00:04:24,720 based on the fact that you believe that this thing is something that you're supposed to be afraid of. 47 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:29,120 And oftentimes that we miss, like we miss represent the feelings of fear as danger, 48 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:33,840 instead of just defining them as an occurrence is something that's happening and just information 49 00:04:33,840 --> 00:04:39,840 about a situation that we want to do something about. And so the simplest thing I can say about 50 00:04:39,840 --> 00:04:48,720 how to manage fear is to believe and accept that the threat that you feel from fear, at least 51 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:53,360 that initial response needs to be challenged and you need to just double check, let's go, okay, 52 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:59,760 I understand this is what I think. Let's explore why that is before we decide not to take any action. 53 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:08,400 Yeah, that's a great fantastic point. So when I, how do you differentiate between actual 54 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:15,040 healthy risk taking like taking a job out of your comfort zone from actually being reckless 55 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:21,360 in pursuit of your ambitions? Well, I'm not the one to judge if you're being reckless. 56 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:26,480 And generally nobody is other than yourself or the people that your life impacts. 57 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:32,160 So let's be fair, I cannot judge your actions. I cannot say that it's bad to be reckless or to, 58 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:37,760 you know, because I have my own aversion to risk, I have my own risk preferences. And the things 59 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:41,840 that I feel that I'm comfortable doing, maybe things that you aren't comfortable doing. And so I 60 00:05:41,840 --> 00:05:47,040 kind of want to move away from this idea of how do we know if our actions are right or not? Well, 61 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:51,280 how about does it relate to something that you want to accomplish in your life? 62 00:05:51,280 --> 00:05:56,720 And do the things that you want to accomplish then relate to the values that you believe that 63 00:05:56,720 --> 00:06:02,400 you represent, like who you are at your core? And if so, and you're holding yourself back from those 64 00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:08,160 things, then that fear, you might need to question it. So generally, what we want to do is take a look at 65 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:14,400 our goals and take a look at our values and say, am I doing everything that I can? Am I being intentional 66 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:20,080 to achieve these things? Or am I holding myself back from something for that we might say as fear? 67 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:26,080 Like for example, I can't tell you how many clients that I work with that are afraid for applying 68 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:30,960 to certain jobs because they doubt that they're good enough. But those jobs relate very much to 69 00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:38,320 their own career goals and applying for a job in itself has a very low success rate. So that action 70 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:43,040 would not be serving them. And so we can look at actions like that to say based on your career goals, 71 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:46,720 based on your values, if who you are and how you want to show up in the world, is the thing that you're 72 00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:55,440 holding is, is that like are you holding yourself back from those things? So would you say that's a 73 00:06:55,440 --> 00:07:03,680 mindset shift with people or how do you address that? So not applying for a job that continues to come 74 00:07:03,680 --> 00:07:08,400 up and people don't take it for example because they don't think they're good enough or maybe they're 75 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:20,400 only 50% of the way qualified. Do you have to do mind shift work with them or help them develop 76 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:25,840 the skills to feel comfortable with applying for the job? Maybe the job calls for other credentials 77 00:07:25,840 --> 00:07:32,000 that they don't have. Like how do you address that for people that won't or have been applied for jobs? 78 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:38,320 Yeah, well everyone's different. And so that's the power of coaching. Coaching says, 79 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:41,920 here's this thing you think is important. So like let's say we've done a bunch of work. We've got 80 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:46,160 and clear who you are, what you believe is important and what you're working towards. Awesome. 81 00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:51,120 So if you're goals, we have your values, we know it's important to you. We have clarity. Now we go great. 82 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:56,160 Go work. Go do it. Go hold yourself accountable. Go try to achieve the things that you want to achieve. 83 00:07:56,160 --> 00:08:01,360 And then you find out all the weeks past and you haven't done anything. Okay, so it's not knowing 84 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:06,160 what to do. That's the issue. What else might it be? And so at times it can be, I don't believe in 85 00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:10,000 myself enough. I don't think I have the skills. I don't have the skills to do the thing. Maybe it's just 86 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:15,520 a knowledge gap. But often it could be that your environment isn't, isn't set around yourself 87 00:08:15,520 --> 00:08:21,200 to serve you. And it could also just be that you're afraid. You're afraid of changing something for whatever 88 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:27,280 reason. And so then depending on where you are as an as an individual, we have to dive into those 89 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:31,680 reasons and figure out what they are because generally some, if you're not doing something, something's 90 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:35,680 holding you back and you peel back the layers until you figure out what that thing is. It's holding you 91 00:08:35,680 --> 00:08:40,480 back. And oftentimes when I work with clients, going to have this, this little quote, we've made 92 00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:45,280 shirts around it. It says, feel your feelings. So you're feeling something great. Instead of reacting 93 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:50,400 to it, take a step back, feel whatever you're feeling, go inside your body, see where what if is your 94 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:54,960 heart race in? Okay. So they just recognize those things. Don't judge them, recognize them. 95 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:58,720 Now think about your thoughts. Now what are you thinking about? What is actually going on in your 96 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:04,640 mind? What are all the phrases and words? And so often in fear, we go, I'm afraid, stop, run. That's 97 00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:08,960 it. But instead we should go, I'm afraid why? And then you go, why? And you go, why? And you 98 00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:12,160 think about your thoughts. You're feeling your feelings, thinking about your thoughts. And this is 99 00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:16,800 the big one. It's, don't believe your beliefs, which means, I'm labeling this thing as fear, 100 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:20,640 this thing that is terrible. It's going to destroy my life. It's going to hurt me. I'm going to be in 101 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:25,680 trouble. Go hold on a second. What if that wasn't true? What if we could challenge that and say, 102 00:09:25,680 --> 00:09:30,960 I want to achieve this thing? What's the different belief I can choose to then make progress towards it? 103 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:35,120 And so each person, depending on the situation, we can talk about maybe even applying for jobs as 104 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:40,000 an example will require different strategies, depending on what the person is struggling with. 105 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:47,200 Yeah, I love that. I know one of my mentors that I've had as a very young, young, I would say, 106 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:52,480 child, but I was eight. He would tell me, now, what's the worst that could happen if you, you know, 107 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:58,640 take your, you know, training wills off your bike and you fall. He used to tell me all the time 108 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:04,400 when I was younger to try things and go and think about what's the worst thing that could happen. 109 00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:10,960 And if I was comfortable with the worst thing, then I should kind of pursue whatever it was 110 00:10:11,920 --> 00:10:18,080 that I was fearful about or sliding, jumping off the high board, dive board is a kid. I'm like, 111 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:24,560 that's too tall. What if I, you know, hurt myself? And so I always learned that I had to consider 112 00:10:24,560 --> 00:10:30,080 what's the worst case scenario and going back to your example like the job. Okay, so, so what if you 113 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:34,880 apply and you don't get it, you know, apply again. What's the worst case that you applied for the job? 114 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:40,400 And they said, no, but what's the best case? You get the interview, right? So, do you have, 115 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:47,360 do you and your arsenal of tools is that, you know, do you have any specific tools that you suggest people 116 00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:54,400 use in order to take bold actions to whatever they're trying to achieve, whether it be a job or, 117 00:10:54,400 --> 00:11:01,520 you know, maybe asking a girl out on a date, it could be something completely not professional 118 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:07,440 related, it could be something personally related as well. Yeah, what you have to do is just basically 119 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:14,240 make the thing that you want and the strategy that you're going to use try to get there more important 120 00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:19,360 than the fears that you have. And the, what's the best thing? What's the worst thing is a very good 121 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:25,200 example of something that you can do? You can go, you can basically say, if this thing is going to work 122 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:30,800 out like, for example, if I get selected for this job, is that more important to me? Is it going to 123 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:40,000 change my life in a positive way? And is that more important than the discomfort I feel from potentially 124 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:46,160 getting an automated rejection letter in an email? So that's a great strategy you can use. So, 125 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:50,720 understanding kind of what you like the understanding the actual fear, which is understanding your 126 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:55,760 feelings and your thoughts and your beliefs and then putting into perspective the thing that you 127 00:11:55,760 --> 00:12:01,440 potentially could achieve. So really detailing that out. Generally, we're generally when you're working 128 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:07,760 through fears, if you focusing on the pillars of self-leadership can be very impactful. So you can do 129 00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:12,800 exercises for creating clarity, exercises for creating confidence, and exercises to make the 130 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:19,040 environment around you like you're more in control of the situation that you are in. It's more, 131 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:23,760 it's oriented towards whatever your goals are. And so within the situation such as applying for 132 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:27,280 jobs, I think it's a little simple, but why not we go, why don't we go for it? The clarity is, 133 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:32,800 okay, so does your current job allow you to live your values personally? So we've identified your 134 00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:37,360 values, we've explored a line and defined them. Let's say no. So that's a big one right there. It's 135 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:41,680 to say, okay, what I'm doing right now is not how, how I want to be defined in the world. That's a, 136 00:12:41,680 --> 00:12:47,040 that's a huge, that's a huge desire. But now we want to say, well, okay, so how might I want to 137 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:51,440 actually achieve these values or show up in the world professionally? Well, maybe you're, 138 00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:54,880 you're working at a company you don't believe in in a job that you don't believe in with a leader that 139 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:59,120 is toxic and not helping you grow as an individual. Maybe you have coworkers that you don't really get 140 00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:03,520 along with maybe the organization itself is terrible boundaries. And so then you go through, okay, 141 00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:06,640 what are my goals? I want to work at a place that is positive boundaries. I want to work at a place 142 00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:10,400 that is this and this and this. So you define your goals. And generally if you know which way you're 143 00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:14,400 going, it's much easier to act in a way that aligns to that. If you don't know where you're going, 144 00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:18,320 this is generally what happens with people in fear. They haven't, they actually have, you get stuck. 145 00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:24,480 You listen to the fear because the fear has a is a greater voice than the fog of ambiguity that you 146 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:29,520 have about higher living your life. So once you maybe you can do some exercises about defining your goals, 147 00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:34,080 your direction, what potentially is needed to actually move in that direction, another one is just 148 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:38,000 believing in yourself and confidence. So maybe you don't apply to that job because you're telling 149 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:45,920 yourself on a daily basis, I'm not good enough or I don't deserve a job like that or I'm not qualified 150 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:50,960 for something like that. And if you fully believe that, you're not going to take action. So then if this 151 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:54,960 is what's holding you back, we go through and start doing some reframing. As you mentioned, 152 00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:58,880 think you mentioned that word prior, which is, okay, if you think you're not qualified, 153 00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:04,240 let's explore why you are qualified. Let's explore all the reasons why you might be a good fit for 154 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:09,680 this role and bring a benefit to this organization. And then you have to then emphasize those 155 00:14:09,680 --> 00:14:13,360 beliefs on a daily basis through a couple different strategies, something as simple as opposed to 156 00:14:13,360 --> 00:14:18,160 no, something as simple as an alarm with you speaking it to yourself. But generally when you are 157 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:22,720 reemphasizing beliefs, it needs to happen regularly and it needs to, you need to have supporting 158 00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:26,880 reasons, or else you're not going to believe it. And the other piece would just be control. So 159 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:30,560 you're never going to apply for a job if you don't have time to apply for jobs. If you're coming home 160 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:35,200 at six, seven, eight o'clock at night from work and you're drained because of your toxic boss and 161 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:39,600 you're just going to say, ah, it's what's the point? I don't have time for this. I just want to eat, 162 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:44,160 I want to watch some TV and go to bed. So then controls about changing your environment to be more 163 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:48,400 supportive of what you're trying to achieve. So that could be creating boundaries, it could be developing 164 00:14:48,400 --> 00:14:53,360 relationships, it could be hiring a coach. So depending again on what's holding you back would be, 165 00:14:53,360 --> 00:14:56,800 would then change the strategies that we would use for the individual that's struggling. 166 00:14:56,800 --> 00:15:02,640 But nothing, nothing is more powerful than convincing yourself that you have nothing to be afraid of, 167 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:09,120 believing, changing your, changing your frame of reference of fear, to information instead of truth. 168 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:16,960 Yeah, I love two, two things that you said, I, or possibly my two favorites is being self-aware and 169 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:22,240 mindful, right? First, a lot of times people, I don't think know what their values are. They're, 170 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:27,440 they think their values are, you know, one way and they're actually the other way. So I love that 171 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:32,640 you pointed that out because you can't really get where you're going. If you don't know what your values 172 00:15:32,640 --> 00:15:40,000 are, like you mentioned with a toxic work environment. So I think some self-study is key to breaking 173 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:46,480 through and becoming, you know, fearless and whatever the tasks you are trying to achieve. And 174 00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:53,760 what about accountability? Do you think that having an accountability partner helps people, 175 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:56,400 you know, bust through some of their fears? 176 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:05,120 Anytime you can have support towards what you're trying to achieve, the more likely you are going to 177 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:10,560 achieve it. If it's hiring a coach or if it's setting a deal with a friend or it's attending a 178 00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:15,520 group like with the job piece, it's go to go to a group every single week or attend a virtual 179 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:21,360 meeting with these kind of job search networks that are online. The anytime that you know that 180 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:24,880 someone else is counting on you, not just yourself and you can put that extra pressure on you, 181 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:29,280 you're going to be able to probably hold yourself accountable. Now, the good have the opposite 182 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:34,720 effect where you get embarrassed and you feel too much pressure and so you distance yourself from 183 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:38,800 those relationships that sometimes you see, but then you have to work through some of the other 184 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:44,400 internal struggles that we've already talked about. Cutting the, you know, accountability is not 185 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:50,000 just that it helps you stay kind of committed to your actions, but generally it also surrounds 186 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:54,240 yourself with more positivity. And oftentimes when we're afraid of something, we're reinforcing 187 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:58,720 that fear through negativity. Through people around us that have those belief, those negative beliefs 188 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:04,000 about us through our own mental, you know, conversation that we're having on a regular basis. 189 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:07,360 And so if we want to help motivate ourselves to take action, we also have to make sure that we 190 00:17:07,360 --> 00:17:14,720 have a good cheerleading squad. Absolutely. You know, made me think of something when you said that, 191 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:21,600 a lot of times I set reminders for myself in my phone. Like I'd say, calendaring them for something, 192 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:28,400 I calendar them to myself about something I'm working on. So holding myself accountable or something 193 00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:35,840 I'm fearful about doing and reminding myself to continue to take, you know, bold steps and whatever 194 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:43,760 I'm, you know, fearful about. So from your perspective, do you have a personal experience or something 195 00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:50,400 that you can share with our listeners about maybe something you were fearful about and you pursued 196 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:59,760 in a chief? I think I was a little bit lucky because I had a lot of disappointments early on in my career 197 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:08,560 that led me to be pretty fearless. So I wanted to be a professional soccer player and you can, 198 00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:12,960 you know, the the percent chance that that's going to occur is pretty low, but for some reason, 199 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:18,560 I got it in my head that it was something that I needed to do, that it was my purpose and my passion. 200 00:18:19,120 --> 00:18:25,600 And so when I lost that, I was really left without any sort of identity of self. I didn't really spend 201 00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:31,360 any time developing relationships and friends. I was pretty socially awkward at the time because I was 202 00:18:31,360 --> 00:18:35,600 focused so much on practicing and practicing three times a day. I didn't really watch TV, didn't go 203 00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:40,320 drinking and getting out with people and you know, just was kind of like pretty empty when I lost that 204 00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:46,560 because it was where I spent my time and what I believed I needed to spend my time on. And so I was 205 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:56,800 pretty afraid of everything, like literally everything, but what's so great at that point in time is I had 206 00:18:56,800 --> 00:19:02,240 a choice to stay afraid. I had a choice to be no one and nothing because I had nothing to rely on 207 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:11,680 anymore. I lost my crutch or figure things out. And so I decided, and this is generally what will 208 00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:16,400 happen with clients when I start working with them when they're in fear mode. You turn away from 209 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:21,280 fear, which is I'm going to lose something. I'm in trouble, something terrible is going to happen to 210 00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:26,400 me if I do this thing. And generally because you have expectations of what the outcome is going to be. 211 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:32,160 And instead you put on your little sailors hat or explorer cap and you go, I'm going on an adventure. 212 00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:38,160 And so I didn't have any expectations. And I just said, I'm going to explore what it means to be 213 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:43,040 social. I'm going to explore what it means to be confident. I'm going to explore a variety of 214 00:19:43,040 --> 00:19:47,600 different jobs that exist in the world. And I'm just going to go explore life because I've held myself 215 00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:54,720 back so much. And if you're able to accept the role of adventurer explorer to say, I don't have a map, 216 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:59,520 I don't know where I'm going, but that's my map. My map is I'm going to wander and find things and 217 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:04,720 see how they see what they're like. And if it doesn't work out, that's awesome. I learned something new. 218 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:10,800 If you can do that and put put on that cap and go on that adventure, you will have incredible 219 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:17,440 experiences and just not have fear because fear then can't latch on to anything because you have 220 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:24,240 no outcomes or expectations. And so for about four or five years, I explored life. I developed who I was, 221 00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:30,320 my identity, my values, myself, my relationships, my friends, etc. And I've had a couple of many 222 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:35,040 journeys since then after that in different segments of my life, like my professional career and such. 223 00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:41,920 But after that fear doesn't exist. Fear is not something that matters because if I start feeling 224 00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:47,120 afraid of something, I realize that if a path doesn't work out towards a specific direction I want to go, 225 00:20:47,120 --> 00:20:50,480 I just pick a different path. That's that's what's so fun about being an explorer. 226 00:20:50,480 --> 00:20:59,920 I love these stuff because I usually correlate it to shoes. So you correlated it to paths. I always say, 227 00:20:59,920 --> 00:21:05,280 man, if that's you didn't fit, I just try on another pair. So I'm going to go with your path. That would 228 00:21:05,280 --> 00:21:14,080 sound better. And I love that you you kind of trained yourself to be comfortable with, you know, 229 00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:22,560 changes and, you know, I wouldn't call it fear or can be failure. I would say it wasn't so much fear. 230 00:21:22,560 --> 00:21:27,040 It was you were just setting out, like you mentioned, on an adventure to figure out who you were, 231 00:21:27,760 --> 00:21:34,240 you know, and what you were good at. And I think when you take it less, I'm not sure the right word, 232 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:39,120 when you take it less serious and you're less serious about it, unless, um, 233 00:21:39,120 --> 00:21:46,400 difficult on yourself, I think it's easier to come out and learn more about yourself and say, 234 00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:52,800 wow, I tried, you know, as a soccer player and I actually really like tennis and I'm pretty good at tennis. 235 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:59,840 And I think you make a really good point unless you try it and you explore something new, you'll 236 00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:06,160 never know what you are good at. And through that perseverance, you're able to find more about 237 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:13,920 yourself and develop yourself and, um, and build confidence to bus through that fear, um, to get to 238 00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:20,880 whatever that goal is. This is funny that we're talking about fear because the example I'm going to 239 00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:28,160 use is about the book that I'm releasing this year called "Becoming Fearless." And so to publish a book, 240 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:34,080 you query agents. Like you can self-publish, you can hybrid publisher, you can find a publish, 241 00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:38,960 an agent that wants to sell your book to a publisher. And I was talking to someone the other day, 242 00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:44,000 like a publicist and like, what's the age of you in? I'm like, I'm querying agents right now. 243 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:48,960 And I remember a piece of advice I received when I was sending out initial kind of queries to 244 00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:54,480 agents in the past and it was, you haven't sent out enough requests until you can wallpaper your room 245 00:22:54,480 --> 00:23:04,160 and rejection letters. And I have 176 queries out right now. And I heard back, no, from a couple, 246 00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:11,280 but I also heard back a yes from today for more information. And life is like that and implying for 247 00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:16,720 jobs is like that. I don't, I don't care how many people say no, how many automated rejections I 248 00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:21,120 get. And I was on a phone with a client this morning and they were getting a little discouraged. And I 249 00:23:21,120 --> 00:23:27,040 say 99% of the applications you send out are going to be no because you're going to take one job. 250 00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:32,000 And maybe some other ones you have some interviews for, but that's just the game you're playing. 251 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:37,280 And the no is just mean you're getting closer to a yes. And this is a huge, just like a huge sales 252 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:41,280 advice too. It's every person you say no, you're eventually going to get a yes, but count how many 253 00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:45,040 no's it takes to get to a yes. Because then as you're counting the no is you're eventually going 254 00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:49,600 to get to the number where you get a yes. And the same is the same thing with life. It's so the 255 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:53,840 the nose just show that you are actually taking action that you're facing your fear. And if you're 256 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:58,320 learning from those no's if they're worth learning from because a lot of the nose are just, 257 00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:03,600 there's just a data point that generally doesn't have any sort of actual information you can take from it. 258 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:08,640 But eventually if you keep going and you know it's going to work you're going to get to your yes. 259 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:14,640 There's another point, fantastic nugget that you mentioned in there. I think it's, 260 00:24:15,120 --> 00:24:21,200 you're attitude, right? So if you have a hundred people reject you for a job, but you're only going 261 00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:28,000 to take one job. So through the 99 rejection, what are you learning through the process? Who are you 262 00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:33,360 becoming? And those, you know, first 10 jobs that rejected you maybe you decided gosh I'm not sure if 263 00:24:33,360 --> 00:24:39,040 I want to be in that industry anymore. If I have to go through, you know, 20 interviews to, you know, 264 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:46,240 to get a job and, you know, rigorous things, I know some people have had many long interview processes 265 00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:50,400 and, you know, they've come out of that process saying, you know, I don't know if I want to work 266 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:56,320 for an organization that it, you know, takes the year to get a job in 20 interview processes. And so, 267 00:24:56,320 --> 00:25:01,600 I think you made two fantastic points. It's, it's what you learn through your process through the 268 00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:07,040 process of, you know, rejection if that's the right word. And then who you become and your 269 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:12,400 attitude, I think is another, you know, when you have your, your mindset on being a professional 270 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:18,480 soccer player and that's all your energy, all your time, your entire being is in being that person. 271 00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:23,680 And then all this sudden you have to pivot, you know, you could have chose to, to things, you know, 272 00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:29,200 to lay around and kind of feel sorry for yourself and realize your dreams and your life is over or you 273 00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:35,120 could really grab those reins, get back on that horse, go figure out who you are, what you're good at 274 00:25:35,120 --> 00:25:40,720 and put it out there to the world. And, and I think that those are fantastic points that you've made 275 00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:44,800 is through, through your journey through fear of being fearless. 276 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:49,280 And just want to comment on also being an executive leader because, I know we, 277 00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:53,920 probably have some executive leaders listening. And I work with a lot of emerging leaders. I work with 278 00:25:53,920 --> 00:26:00,080 a lot of kind of directors and VPs, people that are being considered for greater leadership positions. 279 00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:08,000 And I can't tell you how many of them be like they accept the role that they think they are based on 280 00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:15,520 their job title instead of act through kind of like the skills that they, like utilize the skills 281 00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:20,240 that they have. So someone sitting in a meeting, not talking, not engaging because they think it's 282 00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:25,920 not their topic or not their place, but they have goals of continuing growing in the organization, 283 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:30,560 developing relationships, solidifying executive brand. But for some reason, they've allowed 284 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:38,400 themselves to be boxed in. And being fearless relates to just, are you showing up in a way that is 285 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:44,080 authentically you and not a way that someone or something, something that you believe you need to be? 286 00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:51,680 And in those moments, what's wrong with speaking up, challenging an executive's opinion, 287 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:57,760 sharing your own, calling on someone because they haven't been talking that much. And I think often we 288 00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:07,120 just because of fear or because of whatever beliefs we have, we stop being, we stop being the person 289 00:27:07,120 --> 00:27:14,160 that we know we want to be or are. And I hope, and you know, in terms of strategies, you could start 290 00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:19,360 small and say, okay, every meeting I'm going to just make one comment or every meeting I'm going to 291 00:27:19,360 --> 00:27:25,120 ask one question. And but you eventually start, you start kind of building momentum towards the 292 00:27:25,120 --> 00:27:29,600 actual executive brand or person that you want to be within the professional environment in your life. 293 00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:37,280 I love that. I think that's another great nugget is is holding yourself accountable. Okay, I have 294 00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:43,840 this call with all the senior leaders. And I need to speak up about something, whatever it is. And 295 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:50,800 holding yourself accountable to do that is really key. And if you're in that role, there's a reason 296 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:58,480 you're in that role. And it's it's to grow that organization's business. And so leaning into that 297 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:06,240 in and having an opinion is key, right? Or, or, you know, speaking up when they call on you. Or if not 298 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:10,240 speaking up about something you're passionate about, I think is fantastic advice. 299 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:21,920 Just kind of a couple, you know, we, we all have setbacks in our journey, you know, on this earth. And we 300 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:29,840 all have things that are out of our control and that have set us back or pushed us forward. I guess 301 00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:38,560 in closing, any top three takeaways for our listeners on what they can do today to become fearless. 302 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:42,320 Or maybe any nuggets from your upcoming book you want to share. 303 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:49,120 Yeah, well, well, first off, as I was thinking about this is we were kind of hashing out that speaking 304 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:56,400 up in a meeting kind of situation. We often get discouraged because we have a picture of who we want 305 00:28:56,400 --> 00:29:01,280 to be. And then we have the reality of who we are. And who we are today is struggling with fear, 306 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:07,200 who we want to be is maybe this like person that's, you know, at a podium, leading in all hands, 307 00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:13,600 meeting across an organization. Well, maybe we just need to change our picture of like who we 308 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:18,880 think we need to be today. And so if you're struggling with fear in public speaking, well, 309 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:24,000 asking that one question can be a huge win, no matter if your voice trembled or you thought that 310 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:29,040 it did or jumping into meeting and, you know, sharing a comment in a in the chat box with your 311 00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:33,600 video off is still a win. And so how do we just kind of alter our expectations a little bit and 312 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:38,480 realize that dealing with fear and changing our beliefs and feeling comfortable in different 313 00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:43,600 situations is not something that happens overnight. It's something even my own journey four to five 314 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:47,680 years that was not an understatement. And I was still I had still other experiences after that 315 00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:51,680 where I was learning how to deal with certain aspects of fear. So we have to give ourselves a little 316 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:56,400 bit of grace and then make sure that we understand that the path moving forwards has milestones. It has 317 00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:02,560 objectives. It has summits. It's not just all of a sudden you get transported into this idealistic 318 00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:08,480 version of who you are without fear. I love it. You know, it made me think when you said speaking. 319 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:14,480 I remember the first time I spoke, Dr. Benjamin, it I had to start my speech with my back to the 320 00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:20,640 audience because I was literally trembling and I had the microphone and I turned my back to the 321 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:26,800 audience and I said something I forget to this day when I said to them and I turned back around and 322 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:37,600 they started clapping for me and I think that that change speaking for me and because I was scared out 323 00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:43,920 of my mind to speak and even in a room with two people nevertheless, you know, this room had 50 people 324 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:52,320 and but like you said, you have to push yourself a little bit and set goals and objections and 325 00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:57,280 you know, really hold yourself accountable for who you want to become. 326 00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:03,520 Yeah. And that that honestly is the key is knowing who you want to become, 327 00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:11,840 knowing what you really want to achieve and I and often the things that we say we want to achieve 328 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:19,920 have not really been defined that thoroughly in our mind and if a goal is just a little bit 329 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:26,160 flexible where there's cracks in it and you think you have to do all or nothing to make it work, 330 00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:31,760 it's never going to happen. So I'd say give yourself, like figure out what those small steps are but 331 00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:36,640 even before that really create a picture of what you are working towards and why you're working 332 00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:40,880 towards it and make sure that it's something that you truly want because often we just have a bunch 333 00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:45,280 of things in our to-do list or our let's not be afraid and list that don't really matter to us 334 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:51,120 because life itself is still comfortable and then we have to find we have to find what is going to make 335 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:57,440 us the most uncomfortable to help us just really actually create finally that real desire and 336 00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:03,600 accountability to change. Yeah, I'll give a plug to one of my favorites, Michael Jordan. 337 00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:12,480 I watched his biography and read some information about him on how he visualized for years and years 338 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:17,840 and years making a basket and shooting baskets and doing the same thing and doing the same thing but 339 00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:24,720 he spends a lot of time visualizing who he was and what he was becoming even more so than he did 340 00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:30,960 actually throwing the basket and so I think that's a fantastic point is who do you want to become 341 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:36,240 and what do you want to do and what are your values and if you're not living, you know, I like to say 342 00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:46,160 your best life it's up to you to make those changes and to persevere through that fear. Yeah, no one 343 00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:52,720 else is going to do it for you. Even if you pay higher coach, the person still can't do the work for 344 00:32:52,720 --> 00:33:00,320 you. They can do some of the things but you're ultimately the one responsible and it might sound 345 00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:08,640 really simple, it's not easy but it just has to come from a decision from you first. Yeah, absolutely. 346 00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:15,360 So now that I know that you're launching a book that's great news, congratulations, I love it. 347 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:23,200 Any insider tips you want to tell us about this book or maybe teasers that 348 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:31,760 have what we could expect for your book? Yeah, it's about, I think it's about 60-ish or 70-ish 349 00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:37,040 different tips related to becoming fearless that split into personal and professional. 350 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:45,760 In the personal section, we cover things like mindset, overall your success, relationships, 351 00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:50,160 and then purpose because purpose is a pretty played a pretty big role in my life, especially in 352 00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:54,880 relationship to fear and then a professional section. We cover job satisfaction, leadership, 353 00:33:54,880 --> 00:34:00,400 presence, and career growth. In general, I thought these were all the areas that fear attended 354 00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:05,520 to hold us back and it covers a lot of the stuff we discussed today but gives a little bit more 355 00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:10,000 kind of to-do's and action items that you can use to start working towards this fear. 356 00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:14,160 I mean, there's even one in there about engaging meetings and make the most of your meetings. 357 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:17,680 It's kind of talked about today which is one of the greatest mistakes that I see people make 358 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:22,480 in the professional world. So they want to grow in their career, they want to make a difference, 359 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:29,600 they want to be seen as an executive and they just stay quiet and they multitask or they're afraid 360 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:34,480 of sharing their ideas when it's really the best place for people to actually get eyes on your 361 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:41,520 talent and your skills. Yeah, it's a platform for you to share your- because nobody's going to 362 00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:47,200 advocate for you. I mean, maybe you have a boss that advocates for you but sometimes you got 363 00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:53,520 a self-advocate and share what you know so people know that you know. Otherwise, you might get in a 364 00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:59,680 situation where people are either sharing your ideas and your strategies and they're getting 365 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:05,440 the promotion as opposed to you getting the promotion. And so I love that and I'm shocked that so many 366 00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:13,760 executive leaders are fearful to apply for the jobs and speak up because they're in that 367 00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:20,720 role for a reason, right, to lead teams and strategies and businesses forward and whatever its mission is. 368 00:35:20,720 --> 00:35:27,360 Yeah, it's pretty incredible. We tend to be our worst enemy in the workplace. I mean, I work with 369 00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:34,160 leaders that also they're so checked out. They're so resentful of maybe their manager or leader 370 00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:38,240 or don't feel recognized enough that they just stop taking pride in their work too. So what do you 371 00:35:38,240 --> 00:35:42,080 think happens when someone doesn't feel that they're in the right job and stops showing up 372 00:35:42,720 --> 00:35:47,760 and doesn't take pride in their work themselves? So it just kind of builds on the cycle of negativity 373 00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:51,760 when it comes to work and takes away from their ability to actually feel satisfied at work. 374 00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:57,040 Or they're so they can't say no, they have no boundaries because they're afraid of what it means 375 00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:02,400 for their potential job security and their livelihood. So they do everything but because they're 376 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:05,920 doing everything, they're exhausted, they're drained and start making mistakes and so guess what 377 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:11,440 happens. And so fear in itself has so many negative implications when it comes to our success in 378 00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:18,160 the professional work environment, not just our personal life. Oh, that's so good. I think our 379 00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:23,920 listeners are going to definitely love to hear some of the the nuggets you gave us. Any closing 380 00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:28,880 thoughts or anything that we haven't touched on as it pertains to your listeners that you want to 381 00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:36,000 share with the listeners? Yeah, we try to change our whole life at once. I'm so happy with all these 382 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:40,720 things, but each one of the things that we want to change if we're not doing it as some semblance of 383 00:36:40,720 --> 00:36:47,120 fear attached to it. And so you can choose to attack a little tiny bit of fear or all the fear at once 384 00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:51,600 and you're going to be much more successful if you choose a little tiny bit of fear. So pick one 385 00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:56,320 small thing you want to take some action on and practice. Practice what it's what it feels like to 386 00:36:56,320 --> 00:37:00,880 explore your thoughts and to feel your feelings and to question your beliefs around it, write stuff down, 387 00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:06,240 be your greatest champion within this area and take a small action that's going to prove that 388 00:37:06,240 --> 00:37:13,600 you're nothing to be afraid of. That's great. I love it. That's great advice. Dr. Benjamin, thank you 389 00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:20,000 so much for sharing your insights and your time with our listeners. Connect with Dr. Benjamin, 390 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:27,280 get his book. I can't wait to get it myself. And that's the Executive Connect podcast. Thank you. 391 00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:37,280 [BLANK_AUDIO]