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Greetings, friend.

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And welcome to a chilling Mother's Day collaboration podcast.

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I'm your guide, Shane Waters from the Foul Play Crime Series podcast.

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And together we'll be delving into the shadows of Motherhood on this eerie adventure.

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Thirteen skilled podcasters will join us as we explore the darker side of true crime stories.

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Each with an unsettling connection to Motherhood.

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All participating podcasts are listed in the show notes.

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When you hear what you like, I suggest you go find them.

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Before we embark on our haunting journey, although Mother's Day is typically a time to

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honor the love and sacrifices of mothers.

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Today we'll be exploring the twisted tales that lurk behind the scenes.

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As we explore these chilling stories, let's not forget that the role of a mother often

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embodies the ideas of protection and nourishment, of guiding and nurturing their children through

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life's challenges.

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However, as we'll discover, that's not always the case.

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Sometimes, even in relationships that once flourished with happiness and warmth, things

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can take a dark turn, causing everything to fall apart and crumble.

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It's a sobering reminder that the complexity of human relationships and the depths of the

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human psyche can lead to unpredictable and devastating outcomes.

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Now, let's begin our sinister journey.

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Our adventure starts in an abandoned garden, where overgrown vegetation casts dark shadows

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in a chilling wind whispers secrets through the trees.

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Though once vibrant flowers have wilted and the air is heavy with decay.

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As we make our way through the tangled underbrush, we encounter our first podcast or friend,

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Wendy, who joins me on foul play crime series to share a harrowing tale of motherhood on

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a rye.

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It was a beautiful March day on the west coast of America.

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A German tourist was enjoying the magnificent views as he drove down Highway 1.

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He took regular stops to breathe in the fresh sea air and take photographs to preserve

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his memories.

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The coastline was truly spectacular.

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Highway 1 being a firm favourite for visiting tourists.

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Mile upon mile of unspoilt scenery on either side of the road.

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I have in fact done that drive many times myself and it's not something I will ever get tired

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of seeing.

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But it's not always memorable for the right reasons.

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The road is narrow in places, it curves around the coastline like a snake.

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And you are often close to the edge of the cliffs.

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And accidents happen.

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Maybe you lose concentration for a split second.

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Maybe you swerve to avoid an oncoming vehicle this is too close to you.

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It happens.

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And so when this gentleman spotted a car upside down on the ragged rocks below, as he stooped

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to take a photograph, he assumed that it was an accident.

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Authorities arrived quickly and rescuers descended down the rocks to the upturned vehicle.

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There was no movement.

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There were no cries for help.

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They arrived to silence.

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Inside the GMCU con XL, or what appeared to be two women, with the bodies of three children

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found nearby.

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They were all confirmed dead at the scene.

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What a terrible accident.

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A whole family gone.

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Investigators began to try and piece together what had happened.

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A witness from a local campsite came forward to say that he believed he had seen the vehicle

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earlier in the evening.

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And then at around 3am, he heard an engine revving and tires on gravel.

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He got up to investigate but it was too dark to see anything.

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As he returned to bed, he thought he heard cries for help, but assumed it was animals and

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went back to sleep.

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Following the autopsy, the family were identified as the hearts.

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And this is when the investigation turned from an accident to a suspected murder suicide.

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Jennifer H.38 had been driving the car.

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Her body contained high levels of alcohol.

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Sarah also 38 had high levels of benedrill in her body.

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As did those of their three adopted children who were found near the vehicle.

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Marcus, age 19.

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In Jeremiah and Abigail, both aged 14.

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So what had happened that night?

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As friends of the family heard the news, they just couldn't believe that it wasn't an

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accident.

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Jennifer and Sarah had an idyllic life with their six adopted children.

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Or so it appeared from the outside.

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And yes, you did hear that right.

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There were six children, so where were the other three?

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An extensive search of the crash site discovered the bodies of Hannah, age 16, and Sierra, age 12,

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after a few days.

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There was no sign of 15-year-old Devonte.

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The scene and the data from the car was analysed.

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It showed that Jennifer had pulled the car off highway one onto a gravel turnout.

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70 feet away from the edge of the cliffs.

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She had then accelerated the vehicle to around 90 miles an hour before driving straight

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off the edge of the 100 foot cliffs, landing upside down on the rocks below.

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Killing herself, her wife, and their six children.

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There were no signs that she tried to break.

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Jennifer and Sarah Hart met around 1998 at Northern State University in Aberdeen, South Dakota.

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They had fallen in love and moved to Alexandria, Minnesota.

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In 2004, the couple decided to open their home and share their love with foster children.

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Their first daughter was 15 years old, and she told reporters that one day, Jennifer and Sarah

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dropped her off for an appointment with her therapist and just never returned to collect

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her.

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She never heard from them again.

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In 2006, the couple adopted three siblings from Texas, Marcus, seven years old, Hannah,

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four, and Abigail, two.

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In just two years later, in 2008, they adopted three more siblings, again from Texas.

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Devonte, five years old, Jeremiah, four, and Sierra, three.

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Investigations and discovery said, quote, "The heart tribe was now complete and they looked

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like the model of a progressive 21st century family.

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Two white lesbian mothers and six adopted black children."

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Jennifer stayed at home to look after the children while Sarah went to work.

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Jennifer was always on social media, posting photographs of the family, attending various

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events, and having adventures.

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The posts were always positive, portraying a tight-knit family unit full of smiles, fun,

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and cuddles.

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But the reality was very different.

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The children were all being abused.

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The couple were reported to the authorities a number of times.

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In September 2008, a teacher noticed a bruise on Hannah's arm.

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Hannah told them that her mum had whipped her with a belt.

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No further action was taken, but all of the heart children were taken out of school for

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a year by Sarah and Jennifer.

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Then in November 2010, teachers noticed signs of abuse on Abigail, then age six.

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Abigail said that her mum, Jennifer, had held her head under cold water and punched her.

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All of the heart children were interviewed, and they said that they were regularly refused

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food and were often spanked and grounded.

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Sarah took the blame for Abigail's injuries.

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She was charged and convicted of misdemeanor domestic abuse, and sent into a 12-months community

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service and probation.

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It was at this time that all six of the heart children were removed from school for good.

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With nobody checking on the children's welfare, the abuse escalated.

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In 2013, the family moved to Oregon.

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Attendees at the music festivals that the family attended were concerned that the children

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looked small for their ages, and reported that while in photographs, they were full of

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smiles.

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As soon as the camera was turned away, the children looked lifeless and acted like robots.

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Doing whatever necessary to keep Jennifer happy.

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Jennifer convinced officials that there was nothing wrong, and that people just like to

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pick on them because they were different.

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By 2017, the family were living in Washington in a rural property next to Bruce and Dana Gd

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Kelp.

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Bruce and Dana said the children rarely left the house and that the blinds were always

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drawn.

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In 2017, at around 1.30am, Hannah appeared at Bruce and Dana's door banging frantically,

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asking for help.

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Apparently, she said, "Don't make me go back, they're racist and they abuse us."

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The couple were shocked, but before they could react, Jennifer had arrived to take Hannah

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home.

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The next morning, all eight of the heart family arrived at Bruce and Dana's house to

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apologize for the previous night's events, and Jennifer explained that the children had

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all come from mothers who abused drugs and had some issues.

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Dana told her father what had happened and he reported the hearts of the authorities,

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but no action was taken.

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Things didn't improve for the heart children.

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In just eight months later, Davante approached Bruce while he was cleaning his car and begged

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him for some food.

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Bruce couldn't see the poor lad starving, so helped him out.

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Davante made Bruce promise not to mention this to his parents.

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After this first time, Davante asked for food for himself and his siblings a few more times

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before Bruce and Dana reported the family to authorities again.

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A child protection services worker visited the home, but there was nobody in.

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She left a card.

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The following Saturday, March the 24th, Bruce and Dana noticed that the family's GMC

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Yukon was not in the driveway.

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That same morning at 3am, Sarah had text work to tell them she was too sick to come in.

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The last sighting of the heart family alive was at a safe way store in Fort Bragg, California

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on the morning of Sunday 25th of March.

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The next morning, their car was found belly up on the rocks.

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Davante's body has never been recovered.

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With our heart's pounding, we venture deeper into the garden and discover a murky

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pond.

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The stagnant water is a stark reminder of the darker side of motherhood.

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Beside the pond, we find Brandon, who shares a spine-chilling true crime story from their

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podcast Music City 9-1-1.

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The 9-1-1 dispatcher can get any number of types of calls when their phone rings.

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Most of the time, it's a very routine call like a traffic collision, or someone wanting

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a namelence for a person who's just passed out.

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But on occasion, we might get a call that no one wants to hear.

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The call in which children have been hurt or worse.

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9-1-1, you're 40.

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What's going on there?

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What address are you at?

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Okay, what's going on there?

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What are they doing?

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What do you mean "calling down"?

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They're not calming down.

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Are they repeated the crime?

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So they are conscious?

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Okay, and do you see any medical attention?

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Yes, I don't know what they want.

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Okay, how many children do you have?

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Four.

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Okay, and are they all four not calming down?

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Yes.

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I just can't call them.

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Okay, what's going on there?

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Yes, we need a ambulance immediately for two babies.

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Okay, what's going on there?

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Okay, and what's going on with the babies?

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They're bleeding right now.

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We need an ambulance immediately.

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Where are they bleeding from?

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We need a ambulance immediately.

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My partner is talking to them.

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Why are they bleeding?

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What happened to them?

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I'm not sure.

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Then the ambulance will be ok.

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Okay, I don't want to go to the side.

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I don't want to go to the side.

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I don't want to go to the side.

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I don't want to go to the side.

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I don't want to go to the side.

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Oh my god, something is so wrong there.

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The dispatcher's last comments, "Oh my god, something is so wrong there."

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There's 100% accurate.

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The initial caller, 29-year-old Christina Booth, called 911 just after 1 a.m. on a Sunday

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in January of 2015 in the community of Olympia, Washington.

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Well before the call was placed, Christina and her husband Thomas were enjoying a movie

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with some wine.

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There are three children, one of which at the time was two years old, and the other two,

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twins that were six months old were there in the house with a couple.

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Christina took the two-year-old to bed when the twins started crying.

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During the novel One Call, she said that the babies won't calm down, that she's breastfed

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them, formula fed them, and that they weren't calming down.

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Christina was diagnosed with postpartum depression.

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She was on a prescription medication that was supposed to help her with this, but the overall

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stress was too much for her and she says she reached a breaking point.

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She had said that her husband, who served in the army, often got annoyed at the children

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crying.

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Her solution to this was ghastly.

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She believed if she killed her children, that the house would be quiet again for her husband.

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After putting her two-year-old in bed, she went to the dishwasher, grabbed a knife, and walked

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back to the two-year-old's room where she then slashed her throat.

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She covered up the two-year-old completely, then moved to the twins and did the same with

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them.

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When police arrived, they found the six-month-old twins laying on the couch crying and covered

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in blood.

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The two-year-old was found underneath the covers with dry blood all over her.

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They were all transported to a local hospital where surgery was performed and after all

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three survived.

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Christina was arrested and charged with three counts of attempted murder and then sentenced

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to 14 and a half years in prison and was also ordered to desist from contacting her children

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after a release.

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We leave the pond and enter a desolate village where the laughter of children has been

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silenced.

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Shadows dance across the empty streets, hinting at the unspeakable horrors that once took place

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here.

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In the eerie silence of the village square, we encounter Pia and Alex, who share a terrifying

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tale from their podcast, "Crimes from the East."

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On May 23, 2012, a man discovered burnt skeletal remains in the Payne National Forest

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area outside Mumbai, India.

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These were the remains of 25-year-old Shina Bora.

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Surely her mother was worried about her missing daughter, right?

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While in today's story we will see how this mother may have helped put her own child in

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this horrific state.

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The story starts with Indrani Mukherjee, who grew up in Guwahati in the northeast of India

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as an only child.

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By 18 she had her daughter Shina Bora and a son Mikhail with a young man.

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After a few years, Indrani was fed up with the stagnant life that seemingly was going

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nowhere.

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And so in 1993, when Mikhail was just a toddler, she abandoned them one fine day with her parents

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and moved to the big city Kolkata.

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Indrani was naturally beautiful, with an extroverted personality to match.

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She charmed her way through social clubs and worked her way up the HR consulting industry.

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She met and quickly married a socialite, Sanjay Kanna, with whom she had another daughter.

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Alex, did you have any thoughts so far?

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Okay, so she had her two kids and was like, "No, I don't like these kids."

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And then she goes and has another one.

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So did she like this daughter?

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Like, what's going on?

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Did she treat this child better?

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By all accounts, she absolutely loved this child.

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And it's rather unfair from the sounds of it, the way she abandoned her first two children

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and then completely doated on this child.

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Okay.

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Now feeling restless yet again in 1997, Indrani moved on to Mumbai city.

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She determined to find a partner with deeper pockets and higher ambition.

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She worked her charm and married a wealthy influential TV network executive called Peter

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Mukherjee.

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By this time, Indrani's two children in Guwahati, Shina and Mikhail were living lonely lives

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being cared for by ailing grandparents.

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Shina expressed anger and sadness over her mother's abandonment in her journal.

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So she's abandoned her third daughter or not?

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No.

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But she remarried again.

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Yes.

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She remarried and she took her daughter with her to her new home.

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And did she have contact with the two children she left?

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From what I read, no.

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She never contacted them.

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She never met them.

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She never really even checked on them.

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Shina saw her mother's face in the newspaper one day in a wedding announcement with a famous

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TV executive, Peter Mukherjee.

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She wrote a letter asking to meet her mother.

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In Indrani knew she had to respond and control the narrative because she had hidden her past

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from everyone.

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No one in Kolkata or Mumbai knew she had two children in Guwahati.

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In 2006, Indrani arranged for 18-year-old Shina and 16-year-old Mikhail to meet her at a hotel.

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There she laid it out straight.

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They could stay with her in Mumbai all expenses paid.

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If they agreed to lie to people and say that they were her siblings, not children, they

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begrudgingly agreed.

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Now Indrani separated the siblings and she never really let them stay in touch.

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She weakened their bond.

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She barely paid their minimum expenses and often used money to control their actions.

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Now this went on till one fine day in 2008 when Shina met Peter Mukherjee's son Rahul from

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his previous marriage.

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They felt completely in love.

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They began a relationship which Indrani was completely against.

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She was perhaps jealous of her daughter getting to be part of this wealthy family by possibly

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marrying Rahul.

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Or maybe because Indrani knew Rahul was technically Shina's stepbrother.

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Although I don't know how it would matter, they're not related by blood.

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Indrani only viewed her two children as burdens and reminders of a past that she wanted to erase.

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Shina and Indrani fought often as Indrani devised conniving schemes to get Shina fired

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from jobs and get isolated from friends.

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In Drani even tried to get her son Mikhail committed to rehab.

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By arranging him to be drugged, he woke up in a mental health facility and barely escaped

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a few weeks of being forcibly held there.

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It sounds like maybe she was just too young when she had the first two kids and yeah, she

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probably resented them for that and when she got her second chance at a life, she was

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really possessive of that second chance.

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So the fact that they came back into her life posed some kind of threat to her.

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To add another level of complication, Indrani and Peter allegedly embezzled more than

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a hundred million dollars out of a TV network that they started and closed up within a few

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years.

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They parked this embezzled money in an overseas account in the name of her daughter, Shina

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Bora.

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Ska-chi.

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Shina had threatened to freeze the money if Indrani didn't treat her well.

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I mean, Indrani only knew how to respect money so maybe that's what Shina thought will

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get her attention.

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But Shina was now a pawn in a very dangerous game with an unforgiving williness.

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In 2011, Indrani used her personal doctor to prescribe various anti-psychotic drugs to

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Shina.

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She felt sick and almost died, but for Rahul, who rescued her and took her to another city

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to get better away from Indrani.

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A year later, Indrani secretly got Shina a job back in Mumbai, which she could not refuse.

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And so she and Rahul moved back to Mumbai within Indrani's clutches.

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The happy couple got engaged and planned to get married soon.

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It was endgame for Indrani now.

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In April 2012, Indrani started to send Shina brief messages as if she wanted to patch

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up their tumultuous mother-daughter relationship.

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Indrani dangled the prospect of paying for Shina's MBA in London to get her to meet her.

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Poor Shina believed her mother had finally come around and agreed to meet her for shopping,

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dinner and apartment hunting.

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Indrani took Shina, sorry shopping, and then allegedly gave her a bottle of water, laced

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with a powerful sedative.

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One Shina was fully unconscious.

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Indrani allegedly strangled her with the help of her driver and ex-husband Sanjay Kanna.

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The trio parked the car in the garage overnight with Shina's body in the trunk.

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Indrani had invited her son Mikhail over to her home the same night and tried to get him

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blackout drunk.

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Mikhail was cautious and locked himself in a room pretending to be sick.

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This saved his life.

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And so leaving Mikhail at home, the three got back on the road the next day to dispose of

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Shina's body.

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Indrani put makeup on her deceased daughter's face and leaned her on the seat next to her

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as if she were sleeping.

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They then allegedly dumped Shina's body in the forest and burnt her remains.

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Rahul, Shina's fiance, was beside himself with worry as Shina had been missing for months.

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Indrani told him that Shina had left him and moved to the US.

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Rahul loved her and so he persevered and finally the cops arrested the driver on weapons

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charges which led to this confession of the entire murder plot.

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Both Indrani and Peter were eventually arrested and their trial is slated to start in the

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coming year.

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No matter what the outcome of the trial is, we can be sure of one thing.

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Indrani was a horrible mother who used her kids like disposable assets.

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I wonder what her third child thinks of the whole situation.

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I'm hoping which is not sending any Mother's Day flowers to Indrani and Jail.

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Yeah, I mean she really tried to eliminate both her kids from her life as if they meant

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nothing.

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And on that note, Happy Mother's Day y'all!

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Happy Mother's Day!

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Our journey takes us through a moonlit forest where a gnarled trees twist and reach for

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the sky like the grasping hands of vengeful spirits.

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In the darkness, a mother's love can turn into something much more sinister.

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In a moonlit clearing, we meet Whitney and Melissa who share a story from their podcast,

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Colts, Crimes and Cabernet.

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This day is extra special to Whitney and I for those that don't know we are both boy moms.

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But let's just jump right in.

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May 14, 1995 was Mother's Day in Universal City, California.

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And it was exactly as you can imagine.

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Beautiful weather, a perfect day with a high of 65 degrees.

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What mother wouldn't want to take this opportunity to have a late dinner with her son to celebrate?

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That is exactly what 61 year old Doris Karasi did.

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Her son Paul Karasi invited her and the mother of his two year old son Sonia Salinas out to dinner.

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They settled on the country star restaurant in Universal Studios City Walk.

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For those that don't know, the City Walk is a strip of restaurants and retail stores that

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is just adjacent to Universal Studios amusement park.

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After what appeared to be a lovely dinner, the four family members headed towards their

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car at the top level of the parking garage shortly after 11 pm.

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Now this was not the only available parking at the time, so keep that in mind.

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What happened on the fifth floor is not entirely clear either.

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What we do know is that Paul stumbled it down to the fourth floor of the garage where

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he encountered a security guard.

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He had cuts on his hands and then collapsed near the stairwell.

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He told the guard that two women had been attacked and that his kid was in the car.

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The guards radioed into the police department and there were several units within five miles

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for another call.

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When the security team followed Paul up to his blue Chevy Caprice, they noted that there

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was quite a scene.

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Two women laying on the ground where it seemed as though a struggle had occurred.

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The doors were wide open.

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The guards noted that the victims had been brutally stabbed in their face, chest and had

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their throats deeply slashed.

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Paul and Sonia's son remained strapped into his car seat in the back seat of the car yelling

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for his mother.

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Paul was covered in blood and originally told officers that he did not touch the bodies

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and he did not know why he was covered in blood.

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He claimed that he unlocked the car and he realized he didn't have all of his keys and that

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someone shoved him in the back demanding money.

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He claimed to say he didn't have any and that the attacker took his fanny pack and pushed

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him to the ground.

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Then he stood up and Sonia and Doris had already been murdered.

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He then said he made his way downstairs looking for help.

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In his interrogation, he couldn't remember what his attacker looked like or which way they

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had fled the seat.

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He did say they had male voices but that was all he could share.

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Paramedics arrived on scene and assessed Paul.

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They found a small cut on his thumb that was not bleeding but could not determine where

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the copious amounts of blood on his clothing could have come from.

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The paramedic did mention that Paul's responses to his questions seemed a bit strange.

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Sometimes he would calmly and concisely answer the question and other times he would get

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emotional with his answers and almost seemed confused.

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In the paramedics experience, most people he encounters after a trauma act withdrawn or upset

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but not both.

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The officers that were a few miles away had received a 911 call for a woman that claimed

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she had pulled over on the side of the road and someone had attempted to rob her.

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The 44-year-old Donna Lee had been stabbed in the back and abdomen.

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She was taken to a nearby hospital and treated for her injuries but they were extensive enough

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for her to need to be sedated.

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One officer stayed with her red Chevrolet Barretta which was strangely locked.

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The officer noted that there were two fanny packs, one that the investigators would later

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learn belong to Paul and the other Doris.

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A blue sweater, a latex glove, a washcloth, a pair of wool gloves and a large butcher knife

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with a blunted tip inside one of the fanny packs that had been tossed aside as well as Sonia's

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purse.

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One of these fanny packs had belonged to Doris and Paul had told the guard back at the parking

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garage that they had been robbed.

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As investigations continue, law enforcement learned that Donna and Paul are not only connected,

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they are co-workers and were in a relationship together.

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Doris, Paul and Sonia all worked at the downtown bridge of the Bank of America.

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A neighbor had told police that when Paul, Donna and Sonia left for dinner around 9pm,

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they were happy and chatty but that wasn't the case a few weeks prior.

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Doris had gotten into a fight with Donna, saying she shouldn't be living there and hit Donna

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in the head with her keys.

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00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:38,040
Paul must have put this aside to be able to celebrate Mother's Day with his mom and the

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mother of his child.

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00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:45,160
A little further digging into Paul and Sonia's past seemed to draw out some skeletons.

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00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:51,360
In mid 1993, Sonia had some health complications and she was in and out of the hospital a bit.

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Doris helped with the then baby but when she finally recovered, Sonia decided to move to West

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Hollywood to stay in her family's home to ease the burden on her health for a little while.

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Sonia brought the baby back and forth to see his father and grandmother but this just wasn't

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enough for Paul.

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He made several statements to his co-workers and friends that he was concerned Sonia's

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family wouldn't allow him to see his son.

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He even made a comment to a fellow co-worker that he hoped that B word had died in the

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hospital.

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Others came forward with character testimonies.

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Talking about how Paul was very controlling, especially towards women and that he had an

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arrogant, wannabe attitude and carried a police scanner.

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Heck, even his Chevy Caprice seemed to lend to him wanting to be a member of law enforcement.

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One even stated he would drive to Hollywood and scare sex workers into thinking he was

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watching them for solicitation.

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00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:59,080
In fall of 1994, Sonia took Paul to court for child support and the judge agreed to garnish

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the $375 a month out of his paychecks.

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This put a huge strain on their relationship.

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00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:12,880
He made many veiled threats about how the money she was taking put him in dire financial

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strait. He had over $50,000 in consumer debt and was closing in on the need to file bankruptcy.

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Investigations also yielded that whoever committed these murders seemed to have done their homework.

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The location was one of the few blind spots in the cameras of the garage and remember how

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I said that it was not the only parking available between the restaurant and the parking garage.

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Meaning that he would choose that area.

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May 18th, Paul was arrested but later released when prosecution was not ready to press charges

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due to not quite having enough evidence yet.

468
00:36:54,400 --> 00:37:01,800
A forensic expert recreated the crime scene and evidence for the court and the report showed

469
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:07,080
that one of the victims fought back on her attacker and the clothing that Paul was wearing

470
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:14,280
that night had a bloody handprint and blood splatter that could have only been present had

471
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:17,920
he been close to her during the attack.

472
00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:23,440
Other evidence supported that there was more than one assailant and Donna's blood was

473
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:28,680
found at the scene as well as the victim's blood on Donna's jeans.

474
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:33,200
Both Paul and Donna were arrested on first degree murder charges.

475
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,320
Murder sought the death penalty for both but ultimately Paul received the death penalty

476
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:42,040
and is currently on death row while Donna was sentenced to life in prison without the

477
00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:44,760
possibility of parole.

478
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:57,680
Happy Mother's Day!

479
00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:05,680
As we press on we arrive at a crumbling cafe where mothers once gathered to share stories

480
00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:09,040
and support one another.

481
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:15,520
The dilapidated building stands as a testament to the shadowy secrets that can lie beneath

482
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:19,640
even the most wholesome facades.

483
00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:27,640
Within the crumbling cafe two ghostly figures materialized before us, Amanda and Courtney.

484
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:43,720
They share a bone-chilling tale from their podcast, a nefarious nightmare.

485
00:38:43,720 --> 00:38:48,480
As mothers we always love our children unconditionally and often give them the benefit of the

486
00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:49,480
doubt.

487
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:52,720
Sometimes our job in motherhood is a thankless one.

488
00:38:52,720 --> 00:38:59,600
But with endless dirty diapers, kissed to boo-boo's, bath time, what to make for dinner, navigating

489
00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:04,680
growing pains and finding the nicest way to tell your kid know when they want something

490
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:09,560
they can't have like candy or the latest video game.

491
00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:14,440
And then when you think that things are looking up, you're hit with the inevitable pain that

492
00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:16,240
comes with puberty.

493
00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:22,640
Emotions grow high, rebellion sets in, social and peer pressure increases and let's be

494
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:23,640
honest.

495
00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:27,240
Kids of all ages can be so mean.

496
00:39:27,240 --> 00:39:32,880
Depression is at its all-time high in that age, when teenagers are finding out a lot more

497
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:37,600
about themselves and becoming a version of who they will be for the rest of their lives.

498
00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:43,520
While keeping somewhat of a naive and innocence with them as they learn a lot more about right

499
00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:44,520
and wrong.

500
00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:47,200
With that, I'm Amanda Cronin.

501
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:50,680
And I'm Courtney Fenter, and we are in a furious nightmare.

502
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:56,520
Today we will be discussing the case of Rachel Hudson, who very tragically murdered her mother.

503
00:39:56,520 --> 00:40:01,800
As a teenager, can you remember a time where, despite loving your mom and dad, you also

504
00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:03,960
just couldn't stand them.

505
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:06,520
Some of you are listening to this and cringing.

506
00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:10,640
Some of you are pretending you have no idea what we're talking about.

507
00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:11,760
And let's be real here.

508
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:13,560
You've had that moment.

509
00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:14,800
Don't be shy.

510
00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:15,960
Just admit it.

511
00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:21,400
But unfortunately, some of you may not have had a decent mother or even a mother figure

512
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:28,120
at all, to which we say, "I am so sorry that you've had that pain to endure.

513
00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:30,880
Believe us, we empathize.

514
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:35,320
But many of you are rolling your eyes and chuckling.

515
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:40,040
Remembering the time your mom showed up unexpected at your school dance and did the Roger

516
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:42,480
Rabbit or something in front of everyone.

517
00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:43,480
Yeah.

518
00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:44,480
Moms.

519
00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:45,800
Am I right?

520
00:40:45,800 --> 00:40:49,040
This particular case is heartbreaking.

521
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:57,240
It's about a girl named Rachel, who felt she needed to, essentially, save her mom or herself.

522
00:40:57,240 --> 00:41:01,480
But unfortunately, that's not at all what happened.

523
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:07,360
This case is very hairy for everyone because as mothers, we have this longing to understand

524
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:12,200
and forgive and even empathize with the perpetrator in this case.

525
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:18,360
We also feel extreme terror for ourselves and empathize with the family because this could

526
00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:24,360
very well happen to any mother at any time by any one."

527
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:29,720
The Thanksgiving celebration of the Hudson family took a tragic turn when Rachel, who was

528
00:41:29,720 --> 00:41:35,040
19 years old at the time, fatally shot her mother inside their Virginia residence in the

529
00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:40,520
early hours of the Friday following Thanksgiving in 2013.

530
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:44,040
Of course, she was a mother of her deceased mother, Rachel sent a photograph of her deceased

531
00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:48,440
mother to her father, who was out shopping for Black Friday sales.

532
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:53,360
In an interview exclusively conducted by Dr. Phil from the Hampton Roads Regional Jail

533
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:59,440
and Port Smith, Virginia, Rachel discloses the events that lead up to the murder and expresses

534
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:01,640
her regret for her actions.

535
00:42:01,640 --> 00:42:07,880
Rachel has stated that she had attended to end her mother's life and subsequently her own.

536
00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:13,100
She expressed a desire for her father to be informed of the situation before she took

537
00:42:13,100 --> 00:42:14,700
her own life.

538
00:42:14,700 --> 00:42:19,200
It was at this point that she decided to send him a photograph of her deceased mother

539
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:21,480
to prove her actions.

540
00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:27,200
Rachel explains that her father repeatedly requested to speak with her mother despite her

541
00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:29,800
informing him of her passing.

542
00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:36,440
She wished for her father to believe her as every moment of reality was unbearable and

543
00:42:36,440 --> 00:42:38,440
she longed to depart.

544
00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:43,040
Rachel has shared that her family was under significant strain while caring for her ailing

545
00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:45,960
mother who was slowly passing away.

546
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:50,720
After enduring multiple heart attacks over the years and was also dealing with kidney and

547
00:42:50,720 --> 00:42:55,920
heart failure, quote, "We had been fusing and fighting a lot and we had promised we were

548
00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:57,760
going to get along better."

549
00:42:57,760 --> 00:43:02,960
She said in an interview, "Rachel said that at approximately 1 a.m., she had been engaging

550
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:05,600
in a disagreement with her father, Donald.

551
00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:11,360
According to her account, Donald called her into his room and asked why she was still awake."

552
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:16,000
Rachel responded by saying that she had been using the computer which then led to a heated

553
00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:17,240
exchange.

554
00:43:17,240 --> 00:43:22,120
She recounted feeling as though the situation was hopeless, with no hope for improvement

555
00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:26,280
or change and that stress would be a constant presence in her life.

556
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:31,520
Rachel was aware that her future held difficult times following her mother's passing and Donald

557
00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:36,160
eventually left, leaving Rachel and her mother alone in the residence.

558
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:41,680
It was at this point that Rachel made a decision that would have a lasting impact on the family.

559
00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:44,960
Rachel said, quote, "I wanted to kill myself.

560
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:49,200
I had an overwhelming sense of not wanting to be there anymore."

561
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:53,720
In quote, she said explaining that she felt that her family would be better off without

562
00:43:53,720 --> 00:43:54,720
her.

563
00:43:54,720 --> 00:44:00,000
Rachel then composed a suicide note and proceeded to retrieve a shotgun from a secure

564
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:02,720
gun safe located in her closet.

565
00:44:02,720 --> 00:44:08,720
She expressed concern regarding the individual who would discover her lifeless body, acknowledging

566
00:44:08,720 --> 00:44:13,240
that it would likely be her mother who would hear the sound of the gunshot and find her.

567
00:44:13,240 --> 00:44:17,480
Rachel further explained that she began to contemplate that impact her actions would

568
00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:19,240
have on her family.

569
00:44:19,240 --> 00:44:23,360
Believing that they would be better off without her, in an effort to spare her mother that

570
00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:28,440
anguish of discovering her body, Rachel made the decision to take her own mother's life

571
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:31,280
with a single shot from the shotgun.

572
00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:35,560
Afterward, Rachel made the decision not to take her own life without first speaking with

573
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:36,880
her father.

574
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:41,320
After that incident, according to Rachel, she skimmed the suicide note, felt it didn't

575
00:44:41,320 --> 00:44:45,640
seem adequate, and then claimed that she was apprehensive that her father would arrive

576
00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:51,560
home to find both her and her mother deceased, and there would still be a firearm in the house.

577
00:44:51,560 --> 00:44:55,240
She also expressed concern that he might harm himself.

578
00:44:55,240 --> 00:44:56,240
Quote,

579
00:44:56,240 --> 00:44:57,240
Rachel had said,

580
00:44:57,240 --> 00:45:15,480
"Donald was able to persuade his daughter not to take her own life."

581
00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:19,840
Rachel shared with Dr. Phil that her father advised her against it as he could not bear

582
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:21,680
to lose both of them.

583
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:26,360
She realized that her family was already in a lot of pain because of her actions, and taking

584
00:45:26,360 --> 00:45:29,400
her own life would only make things worse.

585
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:34,540
Dr. Phil asked her if she had the opportunity to relive that night, would she still shoot

586
00:45:34,540 --> 00:45:35,680
her mom?

587
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:36,680
Rachel had answered,

588
00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:37,680
"No."

589
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:42,580
And claiming that she would contact the authorities and inform them of her suicidal ideation

590
00:45:42,580 --> 00:45:45,880
with a request for them to assist her with aid.

591
00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:50,520
Rachel had shown remorse for her actions, claiming that if her mother were able to contact

592
00:45:50,520 --> 00:45:52,520
her, that she would say, quote,

593
00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:59,100
"I'm sorry. I'm sorry and that I love her. I wish I could take it back, and I wish it would

594
00:45:59,100 --> 00:46:04,480
have been different. I didn't want it to be like this at all, and I miss her a lot. I miss

595
00:46:04,480 --> 00:46:10,560
her every day. I think about her. I'm going to do better. I'm going to do something with

596
00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:16,900
my life to fix what I've done. I don't want to be known for this. I want to be known

597
00:46:16,900 --> 00:46:22,000
for something better. One day, I want my parents to be proud of me."

598
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:27,680
Rachel was sentenced to 50 years in prison with 35 years suspended and will serve a total

599
00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:33,360
of 18 years behind bars. After her attorney argued she suffered from mental illness that

600
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:38,640
was undiagnosed for years. This case was very heartbreaking and Courtney and I both hope

601
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:44,320
you gained and learned something from it. With all of this said, happy Mother's Day. Be

602
00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:48,680
safe and be vigilant for when you mess with the bees.

603
00:46:48,680 --> 00:47:08,840
You get the hive.

604
00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:16,080
We leave the Iri Cafe and find ourselves in a desolate playground where rusted swings

605
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:23,540
creak in the wind and abandoned toys are thrown across the grounds. It's here that we meet

606
00:47:23,540 --> 00:47:39,040
Charlie, who recounts a gripping story from her podcast, Crime Lines.

607
00:47:39,040 --> 00:47:45,760
Today we're going to talk about how far a mother's love and rage can push her.

608
00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:52,280
This case starts in 1980 with Mary Ann Bachmeier and her seven-year-old daughter Anna, who lived

609
00:47:52,280 --> 00:47:59,280
in the city of Luebeck, which was then a part of West Germany. Mary Ann had suffered a lot

610
00:47:59,280 --> 00:48:05,040
in her life, including first abuse at the hands of her former Nazi soldier father and then

611
00:48:05,040 --> 00:48:11,200
at the hands of her ultra-religious stepfather. At 16, she was kicked out of her home because

612
00:48:11,200 --> 00:48:18,400
she became pregnant. She placed that child for adoption. At 18, she had her second baby

613
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:24,800
and barely able to support herself Mary Ann also placed that child for adoption.

614
00:48:24,800 --> 00:48:32,720
Then in 1973, Mary Ann gave birth to Anna at the age of 23. Finally with a stable home and

615
00:48:32,720 --> 00:48:39,960
a job, she felt she was at a place to raise her child. But only the one. After Anna's birth,

616
00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:47,240
Mary Ann had her tubes tied. Mary Ann largely raised Anna alone and had to take the little girl to work

617
00:48:47,240 --> 00:48:54,080
with her at a local bar. And when her shift was over and Anna was asleep on a bench somewhere, Mary

618
00:48:54,080 --> 00:49:00,200
Ann would stay late, partying with her friends. During the day when Mary Ann would sleep, Anna would

619
00:49:00,200 --> 00:49:07,880
largely be left to her own devices. At one point, Mary Ann spoke with another family about fostering Anna

620
00:49:07,880 --> 00:49:13,720
for a while while she tried to get her life back on track, but she never went through with it.

621
00:49:13,720 --> 00:49:19,240
It seems living without her child even temporarily was not something Mary Ann wanted to do.

622
00:49:19,240 --> 00:49:27,000
In 1980, Anna was seven years old and was described as an energetic and happy child who was a lot more

623
00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:34,440
independent than most children her age. On the morning of Monday, May 5, 1980, Anna and Mary Ann

624
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:41,400
got into an argument before Anna left for school. Angry Anna stormed out headed not in the direction

625
00:49:41,400 --> 00:49:47,320
of her school, but instead towards a friend's house. Of course, the friend was at school, so Anna just

626
00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:54,840
played outside. One of her neighbors, 35-year-old Klaus Gerbauski, invited Anna into play with his cats.

627
00:49:54,840 --> 00:50:01,880
This was something she had done before, but this time Anna never left the house alive.

628
00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:08,120
When Anna didn't make it home from school that day and Mary Ann couldn't find her, she called the police.

629
00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:15,160
Within about 24 hours, Klaus's fiance showed up at the police station to report that Klaus had confessed

630
00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:24,040
to her that he had killed Anna. Klaus then confessed to the police. He claimed that after he hugged Anna

631
00:50:24,040 --> 00:50:31,480
oh so innocently, she demanded he pay her five marks or she would tell her mother that Klaus had

632
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:37,640
molested her. Klaus said he was afraid to go to jail, so he held Anna in his apartment until he

633
00:50:37,640 --> 00:50:44,600
figured out what to do. He decided he had no other choice but to kill her. He grabbed a pair of his

634
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:50,920
fiancee's pantyhose and strangled the little girl to death. He then put her body into a box and

635
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:56,920
buried her in a shallow grave by the canal. Little Anna's body was then recovered.

636
00:50:58,040 --> 00:51:03,800
The investigators did not believe that this little seven-year-old girl tried to extort Klaus for no

637
00:51:03,800 --> 00:51:10,840
reason. They fully believed that he had either molested her or tried to when she fought back or

638
00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:16,440
threatened to tell her mother what happened. That's when Klaus decided he had to kill her.

639
00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:24,040
They believed this because Klaus had a history. In the early 1970s, Klaus was convicted of molesting

640
00:51:24,040 --> 00:51:31,960
a six-year-old girl and attempting to strangle her. For this, he was given one year of probation.

641
00:51:31,960 --> 00:51:38,360
Less than two years after that, Klaus was arrested for molesting two children, a boy and a girl

642
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:44,760
both nine years old. He was found guilty and sentenced to a year in a psychiatric hospital for treatment.

643
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:51,880
In 1976, Klaus underwent a voluntary castration in an attempt to curb his sex drive.

644
00:51:52,600 --> 00:51:57,480
Not a chemical castration, but a physical one and supposedly irreversible.

645
00:51:57,480 --> 00:52:05,400
However, by 1978, Klaus had gone to a urologist and asked for a hormone replacement therapy

646
00:52:05,400 --> 00:52:12,280
so that he could have a normal sex life with his partner. He had to obtain court approval for this

647
00:52:12,280 --> 00:52:19,560
which he got. So Klaus was a convicted pedophile who was getting hormone therapy to restore his sex

648
00:52:19,560 --> 00:52:26,280
drive. He said he knew no one would believe him that he didn't molest Anna if she accused him due to

649
00:52:26,280 --> 00:52:33,720
his past, and Klaus was right, 40 years later and I still don't believe him. Klaus's trial began in

650
00:52:33,720 --> 00:52:39,960
March 1981, 10 months after Anna's murder. The prosecutors couldn't prove that Anna had been

651
00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:47,880
molested so they focused their case on the murder. The third day of trial occurred on March 6, 1981,

652
00:52:47,880 --> 00:52:54,200
31-year-old Marianne Bachmeier showed up and took her seat. At 10am, Klaus and his attorney came in

653
00:52:54,200 --> 00:53:01,400
as the judge was about to start the testimony. As soon as Klaus sat down, Marianne stood up, pulled out a

654
00:53:01,400 --> 00:53:08,840
buretta 70 from her purse, and opened fire, hitting Klaus six times. When the gun was empty,

655
00:53:08,840 --> 00:53:13,880
Marianne threw it on the ground and waited for the courtroom guards to take her into custody.

656
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:20,600
Klaus died within minutes of hitting the courtroom floor. Marianne was charged with murder,

657
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:26,520
but her defense claimed this was at most a manslaughter as she hadn't planned to kill Klaus.

658
00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:32,520
It was a heat of the moment decision and the reason she had a gun was because the life she was going

659
00:53:32,520 --> 00:53:39,240
to take was her own. On the morning of the shooting, Marianne visited Anna's grave before Klaus and

660
00:53:39,240 --> 00:53:44,760
was overcome with grief. When she arrived at the courthouse, she overheard Klaus and his attorney

661
00:53:44,760 --> 00:53:50,760
talking about him making a statement in court that day. She took her seat, thinking about how Klaus

662
00:53:50,760 --> 00:53:56,360
had accused her sweet daughter of trying to blackmail him, as though her death was because of her

663
00:53:56,360 --> 00:54:02,040
actions and not his. So when Marianne saw the back of Klaus in court and thought about what he was

664
00:54:02,040 --> 00:54:08,440
about to say on the record, she couldn't think rationally. She said she had a vision of Anna and

665
00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:14,920
heard her scream before Marianne pulled the trigger. Marianne was convicted of manslaughter and

666
00:54:14,920 --> 00:54:21,800
unlawful possession of a firearm. She was sentenced to six years but was released early in June 1985.

667
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:26,680
Marianne moved out of the country first with her new husband who taught at a German school

668
00:54:26,680 --> 00:54:33,080
and then in 1990 after they divorced, Marianne moved to Palermo Sicily where she became a hospice worker.

669
00:54:33,640 --> 00:54:39,880
In 1996, Marianne was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. She returned to Germany and died on September

670
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:49,400
17th 1996 at only 46 years old. She was then buried next to Anna. Before her death, Marianne admitted

671
00:54:49,400 --> 00:54:54,600
that she thought about killing Klaus before she did it, undermining her own defense that it was a

672
00:54:54,600 --> 00:55:01,160
heat of the moment decision. And later to erase all doubt, a friend came forward and said that Marianne

673
00:55:01,160 --> 00:55:07,400
had spent days shooting the gun in the basement of the bar where she worked, perfecting her aim so

674
00:55:07,400 --> 00:55:13,640
she could exact her revenge on the man who took her child away from her. In response to this

675
00:55:13,640 --> 00:55:17,400
revelation, most people thought who could blame her.

676
00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:29,480
As we step away from the ghostly playground, we enter a dimly lit alley

677
00:55:30,440 --> 00:55:39,160
where secrets lurk in the shadows. In the gloom, we encounter Jessica, who shares a spying tingling true

678
00:55:39,160 --> 00:55:43,800
crime tale from her show The Asian Madness Podcast.

679
00:55:43,800 --> 00:55:56,440
I've decided to bring you a case that took place in Taiwan because that's where I'm from.

680
00:55:57,080 --> 00:56:02,840
Quick warning, this case is pretty depressing, not at all happy. Her name is Uruushu,

681
00:56:02,840 --> 00:56:09,000
and she was a young mother who did everything she could, but sometimes giving it your all just isn't

682
00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:17,080
enough. Let's begin. Who was Uruushu? I will refer to her as Uru for the segment. She was born in

683
00:56:17,080 --> 00:56:23,880
late March 1990, and if you do the math, she is very young. Unfortunately, like many others out there,

684
00:56:23,880 --> 00:56:28,760
she came from a broken home where her father physically abused her mother and the two eventually

685
00:56:28,760 --> 00:56:34,040
divorced before she started elementary school. Her mother tried her best, even at one point

686
00:56:34,040 --> 00:56:39,720
remarrying, hoping to give her four children a father figure and a stable family dynamic.

687
00:56:39,720 --> 00:56:44,840
Despite her efforts, the things who experience as a child really ended up impacting her.

688
00:56:44,840 --> 00:56:50,920
Growing up, her biggest dream was to have a family of her own, have a present and loving husband

689
00:56:50,920 --> 00:56:56,360
slash father. That's very normal. Many of us look forward to having our own families,

690
00:56:56,360 --> 00:57:03,320
but sometimes that want and need can cloud our judgments. When Uruushu was 19, she met and fell in love

691
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:09,480
with a man who would eventually become her husband. It was not a fairy tale romance. He would not turn

692
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:15,560
out to be the prince charming she was hoping for. He was abusive, she worked her ass off, and after

693
00:57:15,560 --> 00:57:20,520
falling pregnant the first time, he managed to convince her to abort the baby because it was not a

694
00:57:20,520 --> 00:57:26,760
good time. In a sense I get it, you're both struggling, it's very difficult to add another member to

695
00:57:26,760 --> 00:57:33,400
your family. She did as he demanded, but soon after she fell pregnant again, both her husband and

696
00:57:33,400 --> 00:57:39,000
her mother again, tried to tell her not to have this baby, that it will only add stress on financial

697
00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:45,000
issues to her already problematic situation. This time though, she was determined to keep her baby.

698
00:57:45,800 --> 00:57:52,120
As a quick side note, abortion is very much legal in Taiwan, depending on how far along you are of course.

699
00:57:52,120 --> 00:57:58,920
Uruushu has been did not like that she had a baby, but what could he do? The two decided to get married

700
00:57:58,920 --> 00:58:06,600
anyway in the year 2013 when Uruushu was 23. Taiwan is not super conservative, but it's quite uncommon

701
00:58:06,600 --> 00:58:12,920
to see unmarried couples with kids. So now that they got married, you think that at least play the part

702
00:58:12,920 --> 00:58:19,320
of a happy family, right? Well no, it was at that during their entire marriage, the couple of separately.

703
00:58:19,320 --> 00:58:25,720
According to sources, the only time the husband was show up to see his wife was when he wanted sex.

704
00:58:25,720 --> 00:58:32,120
He did nothing for the baby, it was all on her, with her family members occasionally pitching in.

705
00:58:32,120 --> 00:58:37,240
This unhealthy dynamic continued on for a bit, and by the year 2015,

706
00:58:37,240 --> 00:58:43,560
Uruh had her second baby, and the couple decided to divorce. At this point, staying married was

707
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:47,960
completely pointless. She was the only parent giving two shits about their kids anyway.

708
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:52,520
Not saying her ex-husband did not have a say in whether she had a baby or not,

709
00:58:52,520 --> 00:58:59,080
but it did not seem like they practiced safe sex. And if they didn't, well, there are usually

710
00:58:59,080 --> 00:59:06,280
consequences, like, say getting pregnant. So beginning in the year 2015, we became a single mother.

711
00:59:06,280 --> 00:59:11,400
Her educational background was very limited, as in she was only a high school graduate and did not

712
00:59:11,400 --> 00:59:17,080
earn another degree. Obviously, there are various jobs that do not require college degrees,

713
00:59:17,080 --> 00:59:23,480
but it was difficult. Most jobs she came across were either low-paying or the hours required

714
00:59:23,480 --> 00:59:28,600
were over the top. Working regular jobs in Taiwan can be very excruciating.

715
00:59:28,600 --> 00:59:35,240
Not as bad as it is in Japan or Korea, but there's usually mandatory overtime with no pay,

716
00:59:35,240 --> 00:59:41,480
very traditional work styles, and of course, low pay, despite living costs not being that high,

717
00:59:41,480 --> 00:59:48,040
compared to say, the US. Honestly, all the jobs she looked into were doable, definitely could

718
00:59:48,040 --> 00:59:54,440
have been enough for her, but a hundred percent not enough with two kids. She did find a decent paying

719
00:59:54,440 --> 00:59:59,800
job at one point, but because they required her to come in every other Saturday, it meant that she

720
00:59:59,800 --> 01:00:05,400
would have to find childcare for her kids, and that extra expense alone just did not make any sense to

721
01:00:05,400 --> 01:00:10,680
her, so she had to give that up. She would sometimes work several part-time jobs just to have enough

722
01:00:10,680 --> 01:00:17,080
for her and her two kids. You might be thinking, she has family though, right? Her mom, her siblings,

723
01:00:17,080 --> 01:00:22,840
even her sister-in-law, but we were not there. We're not part of that family. It's very difficult

724
01:00:22,840 --> 01:00:28,760
to say how involved they were if they even wanted to be involved, or if we even wanted to ask

725
01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:33,400
her family members for help. She might have wanted to prove to others that she could do it,

726
01:00:33,400 --> 01:00:40,120
that she was not a failure, and as they were her children, maybe she felt it was her sole duty to provide.

727
01:00:40,120 --> 01:00:47,880
By the year 2019, 29-year-old Wu was on the brink of a breakdown. She had no choice but to move in

728
01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:54,040
with her brother and her sister-in-law. She was heavily depressed, in financial ruin, had an unhealthy

729
01:00:54,040 --> 01:00:59,960
relationship with alcohol, and also took a lot of sleeping pills. Her health was worsening day by day,

730
01:00:59,960 --> 01:01:06,520
and people around her began to notice a drastic change. She had mentioned suicide multiple times,

731
01:01:06,520 --> 01:01:12,040
and her first recorded attempt was in November of 2019, where she tried to duct tape her mouth and

732
01:01:12,040 --> 01:01:18,360
nose shut in order to fixate. She was found in time, but instead of helping her, her brother found

733
01:01:18,360 --> 01:01:24,600
her to be annoying. He allegedly texted her after her attempt, saying something along the lines of,

734
01:01:24,600 --> 01:01:30,600
"What is your issue? What are you doing? Trying to die? Do I look like charity?" You better explain

735
01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:35,800
what a duct tape thing was about. If you want to die, take your kids to their father and die together.

736
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:43,880
Better yet, wear a red dress. FYI, it's pretty typical for some female ghosts in Taiwan lore to wear

737
01:01:43,880 --> 01:01:49,000
red dresses or clothing, because supposedly if you kill yourself wearing red, you come back as

738
01:01:49,000 --> 01:01:55,720
a vengeful spirit. But anyway, the text was very harsh, and understand he felt a lot of pressure,

739
01:01:55,720 --> 01:02:02,120
and if she were to die, would he have to take over for the two children? As someone who was already

740
01:02:02,120 --> 01:02:07,880
depressed and ready to die, these words only made it worse for her. She felt guilty, and like she

741
01:02:07,880 --> 01:02:15,720
was a terrible mother. Around January of 2020, Shed was so much weight, she weighed a whopping 32 kilograms,

742
01:02:15,720 --> 01:02:22,200
approximately 70 pounds. Her two kids also required expensive medical care. How was she going to make

743
01:02:22,200 --> 01:02:28,600
this work? In February of 2020, we decided to take her two kids and leave her brother's home.

744
01:02:28,600 --> 01:02:33,880
Where was she planning on going? Is unknown. Her daughter's teacher found out and informed

745
01:02:33,880 --> 01:02:39,480
social services, stating that we was a single mother with financial stress, and that she needed help.

746
01:02:39,480 --> 01:02:45,160
When his brother got involved, and despite his previous complaints, he managed to get her to come

747
01:02:45,160 --> 01:02:51,800
back to his place, but set some ground rules. She had to stop sleeping all day, and she had to get a

748
01:02:51,800 --> 01:02:58,440
job before the end of March. The two argued over this, and once again, we'll grab two kids and left.

749
01:02:59,400 --> 01:03:04,440
If you haven't noticed, mental health issues is not widely understood or even accepted in

750
01:03:04,440 --> 01:03:10,520
Taiwan yet. The new generation, of course, is a lot more open-minded, but overall, it's still

751
01:03:10,520 --> 01:03:16,600
considered kind of like a myth, like a getover kind of situation. It's very frustrating.

752
01:03:16,600 --> 01:03:22,920
She took them to a motel, and that's when she decided she had to end it for everyone. She tried

753
01:03:22,920 --> 01:03:28,840
to suffocate her kids to death with a pillow, but that failed miserably. A couple days after,

754
01:03:28,840 --> 01:03:33,800
her first attempt to kill them, she tried her hand at it again, this time putting her crushed

755
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:39,160
up sleeping pills in their jowl cups. Once the two kids fell into a deep sleep, she proceeded to

756
01:03:39,160 --> 01:03:45,880
strangle them with a rope. This time, she succeeded. Of course, she didn't want to live either.

757
01:03:45,880 --> 01:03:51,400
She grabbed the handful of her depression and sleeping pills, swallowed them, drank alcohol,

758
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:57,400
and fell asleep. She believed that this would have been enough to kill her, but turns out that was

759
01:03:57,400 --> 01:04:04,760
not the case. She was saved again just in time. This was a very upsetting case overall. A young woman

760
01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:10,120
who became a mother to two kids, struggled her entire life to find a kind of warmth she lacked as a

761
01:04:10,120 --> 01:04:17,080
child, but only to end up realizing how cold and lonely the world really was for her. Long story short,

762
01:04:17,080 --> 01:04:23,240
the judge on her trial was not at all sympathetic to her situation. I know, she killed her two young

763
01:04:23,240 --> 01:04:29,640
children. That is horrible, but things are rarely ever black and white. She did not kill out of

764
01:04:29,640 --> 01:04:35,720
malice and she had intentions of ending her life as well. Not that it makes it any better. The judge

765
01:04:35,720 --> 01:04:41,720
refused to look at her overall situation. He called her a bad mother, told her to get it together.

766
01:04:41,720 --> 01:04:48,120
That tons of people are in her situation. If they can make it work, why can't she? If she loved her

767
01:04:48,120 --> 01:04:54,360
kids, she would never have killed them. Therefore, she never loved them. He completely overlooked the

768
01:04:54,360 --> 01:05:00,840
court issues, basically rejecting anything that could have led up to such tragedy. I hated when

769
01:05:00,840 --> 01:05:07,240
people refused to let others have a difficult time. Like you're struggling? So-and-so have it

770
01:05:07,240 --> 01:05:13,000
worse. It's not a suffering contest. No one wants to win the trophy for a worse life ever.

771
01:05:13,880 --> 01:05:18,920
Who wasn't initially sentenced to death, but her sentence was later reduced to life in prison.

772
01:05:18,920 --> 01:05:24,520
So there you have it. A very tragic story of a young mother who wanted to be the best for her

773
01:05:24,520 --> 01:05:29,880
children, who wanted a complete family, but in the end had to resort to some extreme

774
01:05:29,880 --> 01:05:37,160
boys. I know for sure she's not the only struggling parent out there. Yes, you could have been worse,

775
01:05:37,160 --> 01:05:43,000
but does it mean her situation wasn't terrible? Everyone reacts differently under harsh conditions.

776
01:05:43,800 --> 01:05:48,440
Couple that with her crippling depression. It just was a disaster waiting to happen.

777
01:05:48,440 --> 01:05:54,680
I want to give a shout out to all the mothers out there, except to select few like Casey Anthony

778
01:05:54,680 --> 01:06:01,000
and Susan Smith, because you guys keep the family going. Keep the kids alive, and I know there are

779
01:06:01,000 --> 01:06:08,120
sacrifices along the way. Thank you so much, and happy Mother's Day to you lovely people. Stay safe,

780
01:06:08,600 --> 01:06:19,960
till next time.

781
01:06:19,960 --> 01:06:26,040
We leave the shadows of the alley and find ourselves in a once grand dimension,

782
01:06:26,040 --> 01:06:33,880
now overgrown with ivy and shrouded in darkness. It's here we make camp for the night,

783
01:06:34,600 --> 01:06:41,640
and in the first night of our Mother's Day collaboration. Remember, friend, all the shows you heard

784
01:06:41,640 --> 01:06:48,520
from tonight are listed in the show notes in order of appearance, along with a link to find them.

785
01:06:48,520 --> 01:06:55,560
I am Shane Waters from Fowl Play Crime series. It's been a pleasure to be your guide tonight.

786
01:06:55,560 --> 01:07:01,240
I'll see you tomorrow for part two. Good night.

787
01:07:01,240 --> 01:07:11,240
[Music]

788
01:07:11,240 --> 01:07:21,240
[BLANK_AUDIO]