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And I hear them call me by my name.
So I run into the kitchen to check and there's nobody there.
And I start to like hear like my closet door start to open.
All of a sudden for no reason I woke up in the middle of the night.
My eyes just snapped open and it's that strange feeling that you have when something wakes
you up.
And you don't know what has woken you up until you either see what it was or you hear
whatever it was.
If you like all things spooky, check out as espooky tales.
We, Cristina and MJ talk about all things espooky.
And we'll talk about the haunted places, myths and legends.
With the focus on Latin America, new episodes every Friday.
Listen in your favorite podcast apps as well as espookytales.com.
You guys were back.
And don't worry, we did get more wine.
Well, of course.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Hi, Cassie.
Hi, Caitlyn.
Hi, creepy people.
Hi.
Hello.
Hello, out there.
What show is this again?
PNW Haunts and Homicides.
Oh, my.
We're going to get through the worst parts pretty quickly.
And then we'll just get to talk about stuff that's--
it's not as bad.
OK.
I think.
Yeah.
Like I remember.
And then we get to do a tarot reading.
So it's all going to be good-ish in the end.
Yeah.
Cassie does her editing magic, makes me sound like a genius.
Everyone lives happily ever after.
I bedazzle the fuck out of you.
Oh, boy.
Apparently, I need to be bedazzled.
So much so that if you met Caitlyn in real life,
you'd be like, who am I talking to?
Do you think--
No.
Do you think they were confused when they met me at PNW
True Crime Fest?
I thought you were like, do you think?
Oh.
I mean, it's a serious question.
No.
OK.
You were an eloquent, beautiful speaker.
We didn't edit one bit of the live from PNW True Crime Fest.
That's true.
That was all natural.
Yeah.
I'm kind of like a rock where either--
you just apply an extreme amount of pressure.
And I'm either just crushed into 1,000 shards.
Or I become something stronger.
Or--
Like a diamond.
She's like the rock, and she raises one of her eyebrows.
I do do that.
I'm doing it right now.
I was sitting on that joke ever since she said rock.
And I was like giggling to myself like, he--
I was like rocks are not that funny, Cassie.
Oh, boy.
Anyway.
Well, I mean, we tried.
We kept it light-hearted for a minute there.
All right.
Part two of Cal Coburn Brown.
Agreed.
On Memorial Day, May 27 of 1991,
the King County Police discovered the body of a 21-year-old woman
Ms. Holly C. Washa in the trunk of her 1985
Blue.
Automobile parked in space 266 of a budget park and ride
lot near the Seattle Tacoma Airport.
Because, of course, by then, they
had received a telephone call from the detectives
in Palm Springs.
Holly was found wearing a leather jacket that
was covered in blood with a strap of her purse around her neck.
In fact, by this time, the strap had
managed to work its way into one of the deep slash wounds
on her neck.
No.
I know that's probably the worst part
of the description of her body when she was discovered.
Yeah.
I don't like it.
Cal would reveal that he moved the vehicle
after realizing that Holly's blood was
beginning to spill out from the trunk of her vehicle.
Well, yeah, I wonder why that was happening.
Yeah.
Funny how that will happen when you slit someone's throat
and leave them in a trunk.
And stab them how many times?
I'm not even sure.
That's a really--
Yeah.
No, I mean, it's--
Apparently, the spot that he moved the vehicle to
before hopping on his flight to meet Susan,
he assumed her blood would be washed away by the Seattle rain.
Yeah, I--
Yeah.
I deeply, deeply hate that.
On June 11, of 1991, in the King County Superior
Court, Cal Cobra and Brown was charged with aggravated murder
in the first degree.
He was arraigned on February 26 of 1992.
A notice to determine whether the death penalty should be imposed
was filed on March 24, 1992.
The trial itself began with jury selection
on October 25 of the following year, 1993.
It's like crazy to see how this just
drags out over already multiple cares.
Yeah.
When he so clearly did it, and he admitted
to the other one, it still druged out that long.
Yeah.
We're looking at June of '91 to October of '93.
And that's just when the trial is beginning.
Wow.
And he applied guilty to everything, right?
There wasn't--
Well, I mean, the tough thing about it
is that you complete guilty and still
be trying to position yourself in a way
that lessens your sentence.
And depending on the situation, that might look differently.
But the thing that's tough for me is,
we get a lot of case suggestions or people sending us
news updates about cases that are not yet at trial.
And a lot of times, you can't publicly
access information about what's happened in the case
up to that point.
And sadly, unless I just become an investigative journalist,
I can't really do much with those until we have a little bit more.
Yeah.
Well, what are you doing with your life over there
than you do with the month?
Yeah.
Yeah, I'm going to go to law school.
OK.
What?
Like it's hard.
The guilt phase of court testimony
began following the Thanksgiving holiday on November 30th.
Happy holidays.
On December 10th of 1993, the jury
returned a verdict of guilty of premeditated murder
in the first degree, finding that Cal
committed the murder to conceal commission of a crime
or to protect or conceal his identity
and found aggravating circumstances
of robbery in the first or second degree,
rape in the first or second degree,
and kidnapping in the first degree as well.
And that takes us to the penalty phase of the trial, which
began on December 15th of 1993.
Seriously.
What a way to live in up the holidays.
Yeah, right.
Just-- it's a lot.
What do you mean they can't really pause?
Because it's like, oh, it's the holiday season we can't try
to be the murder.
Yeah.
No, I mean, it's kind of serious.
So we just kind of have to keep on chugging
lugging through, but--
Yeah.
I do feel bad for anybody that that is kind of thrust upon them.
Yeah.
Well, like the judge and the lawyers and all the jurors--
during that time.
I mean, more so for the jurors, because that's not
what they do in their everyday lives.
Where is the judge and the lawyers,
while it may not always be a case that's quite the spurtle,
they're always working in the legal system, in the court system.
There's some tenuous string to at least the processes
and all of that.
Think about it.
As a juror, you're having to learn how every piece of this system
works.
And then also, apparently, you're probably
sending other relatives out to do your Christmas shopping.
Oh, yeah.
You're a bit tied up.
So I know.
First world problems, I get it.
But I'm just saying it's a tough situation
to be in from so many different angles.
Yeah.
That's all.
Yeah.
It's not a competition.
Yeah.
The suffering Olympics.
It's where no one wins.
Right.
Then on December 27th of 1993--
again, seriously, just two days after Christmas, like--
Wow.
It's just a lot.
It's a lot.
Do you think they had Christmas off?
Oh, I'm sure they do.
Yeah, federal courts, you are relieved of duty, I'm sure,
for all of those major holidays.
So just two days after Christmas,
the jury returned a verdict finding
there were not sufficient mitigating circumstances
to merit leniency.
That sounds good.
Yeah, it does, right?
I wasn't quite sure how you would react to that,
because I thought you might go, wait, what part
of this whole process are--
Where are we at?
What's happening?
Your words confuse me, Haylon.
It is a good thing, potentially.
Some people may be upset by this.
But not these two today.
Yeah, not today.
Not today, Satan.
So we're in the sentencing phase at this point, penalty
phase.
I love it when I can find something that
buttons up the court proceedings with a summary that
kind of incorporates somehow both the legal jargon
that my nerd brain craves, but isn't completely obtuse.
Yeah.
And I just have to say that at this point in my research
for the case, the dopamine was severely lacking.
And being able to read it and then spell it out for you guys
like this kind of restored the juice.
Good.
On January 28, 1994, the death sentence was imposed.
What?
I know.
And she's like, I actually knew that.
I didn't know that.
But still, when I read it, I was shocked.
Yeah.
Because you don't hear that a lot around here,
especially this recently, like in the '90s, you know?
Well, we think of--
I knew the '90s.
--the '90s were recent.
They were.
Yeah.
Well, in terms of when you're talking about precedence
being set--
Yeah.
--because the legal system obviously is quite a bit older
than we are.
So recent is-- it's all relative.
So I mean, I take your meaning.
Yeah.
I'm not old.
Yeah.
We're basically infants.
In the '90s.
Yeah.
Yeah, in the '90s, when his legal team
would later appeal his sentence with a Supreme Court
of Washington, the following opinion
was returned in July of 1997, stating,
a balance death sentence is not disproportionate
when his criminal history is considered.
His record includes prior convictions
for assault with a deadly weapon, grand theft,
attempted assault in the first degree, assault
in the second degree, attempted murder in the first degree,
aggravated mayhem, torture, false imprisonment,
and robbery in the first degree.
His criminal record shows a history of violence towards others.
His criminal history is comparatively more extensive
than that of other appellans who received the death penalty.
And this is important.
OK.
For his final meal, Cal Coburn Brown had a combination
pizza and apple pie with both coffee and milk.
Of course, his last meal isn't how we're going to end this story
because he also had a few things to say.
I don't care.
What kind of pizza did he have?
Combination.
I know, but from where?
I don't know.
You really want to hone in on the pizza?
I hate that they get to choose their last meal.
I don't give a fuck.
Yeah.
Have cold oatmeal.
Yeah.
You know, when there's not quite enough water,
so it's actually kind of undercooked,
do they even need to eat?
Like, where they're going?
Do they need sustenance?
Probably not.
He spoke just prior to his execution.
I understand your feelings and your hatred for me.
For the actions I took against your daughter and sister.
I hope the actions that you've done
are not what you're going to do.
I hope the actions taken tonight give you the closure you seek.
Looking toward the witnesses, he acknowledged the anger of Washa's family,
but did not apologize.
Brown complained about sentencing disparities,
citing the case of Green River Killer Gary L. Ridgeway,
who was sentenced to life in prison for the murders of 48 women
after he cooperated with authorities.
And why, too, Tony, who could someday be released from prison
despite his role in the deaths of 13 people in Seattle's 1983
Wami Massacre.
Oh.
He went on to state, I only killed one victim.
I cannot really see that there is true justice,
hopefully sometime in the future, that gets straightened out.
When he was done, Brown said, thank you.
God bless you and God bless my family.
Thank you.
I guess.
Thank you for letting him speak.
Yeah.
I guess so.
Yeah.
The Supreme Court has already said your criminal history
is comparatively more extensive than that of other appellans
who received the death penalty.
And listen, I have some complicated feelings about the death penalty.
I think a lot of us do.
Yeah.
Kal, I'm pretty sure you did it.
And I'm pretty sure that I want you to die for it.
It was fucked up.
But I mean, I do see his point.
Like, he did only kill one person.
So, like, you know, it's no 48.
Unfortunately.
I mean, sarcastic.
Everybody just so everybody knows.
Unfortunately, in these situations, what we run into is individuals like Ridgeway have
unfortunately by virtue of the volume, the number, I mean, absolutely overwhelming number
of victims that he has.
It affords him a bargaining chip because there are so many where bodies haven't been recovered
or they may not be able to give the family answers unless he's willing to talk.
Yeah.
And I hate to say this, but in some respects, it rewards serial killers.
If you think about it in that way.
Yeah.
I hate everything about this case and about Ridgeway, but just to look at it very coldly,
very logically, it's unfortunate.
He could have killed Susan though.
It is attempted murder.
Yeah.
I don't think that he didn't intend to kill her.
He's let her throw.
Yeah, to think what he would have done.
Yeah.
I don't want to.
No, I mean, we've already talked about it with Holly and there's no doubt in my mind
that where things stopped with Susan is by happenstance.
Unlike Holly's horrific ordeal, Cal Coburn Brown was dead roughly 90 seconds after being
intravenously administered the five grams of sodium thio-pental.
Cal's legal team and numerous private citizens spoke up against the use of capital punishment
as a moral and ethical issue.
In fact, his legal team had once argued that the state's three drug method of lethal injection,
which is a combination of an anesthetic, a paralyzer, and a heart attack inducing drug,
constituted cruel and unusual punishment and was prone to error, resulting in an ultimately
temporary stay of execution from the state Supreme Court.
Did they argue this before or after?
Before.
Okay.
But they still have.
That's how he got the state of execution.
Okay.
Yeah.
In July of 2010, the state switched to a singular drug method for execution, making it one
of only two states to use the method, the other being Ohio.
And of course, making the legal argument that kept him alive some additional months no longer
valid reasoning to further delay his execution, at least legally speaking.
If you don't like the three drug method and we switched to one, you're going to have to
find some peer reviewed studies that take issue with a single drug method to get another
stay of execution.
Brown's execution marked the first time the state has used a single drug method of execution.
He was a 78th man to be executed in Washington.
And to date, Cal Coburn Brown was the last person executed in the state of Washington.
Well, that is crazy.
That is crazy.
Yeah.
It was crazy to me that he was the first to use that method.
Yeah.
But then also he was the last.
Yeah.
I know.
It's kind of a momentous sort of occurrence, which feels a little bit odd to say, but it
looks as though he may end up being the final execution as governor J. Inzley issued a
moratorium on executions in 2014.
But let's address something about this case that particularly angered me.
In order to do so, we just need to time travel back to 1984.
Okay.
Just real quick.
Back then he was a freshman at Oregon State University and had been introduced to a woman
with two young sons by her babysitter.
Oh.
Okay.
He showed up at the woman's home wearing a hat and backpack.
He persuaded her to let him rest what he claimed was a sprained leg.
When she turned her head to call him a cab, he attempted to choke her using like a leather
strap type device.
Geez.
Was it from the backpack?
He may have had it stored in the backpack.
Yeah.
It's sort of an unusual incident.
The whole thing is very bizarre.
Later she would state that she rolled to her side and saw him wild eyed staring into her
face.
Ooh.
Luckily, a nearby police officer heard her screams and was able to place cow under
arrest.
Now these next two statements I wouldn't say are fun facts by any stretch, but I literally
can't decide which one is scarier.
Police found a large knife and a roll of two inch wide duct tape in his backpack.
No.
He had a murder kit.
And number two, the woman's two small sons were home during the attack.
That's terrifying.
Like, what was he going to do to all of them?
I mean, maybe he had no idea that the kids were even there, you know, depending on the time
of day and how much he knew about her.
He may have assumed she was home alone, which might make it worse if he startled my children.
What's he going to do?
I just...
It could have been so much worse.
It's horrific, but it could have been so much worse.
Calcoburn Brown was sentenced as a dangerous offender for this attempted assault in Corvallis
Oregon.
But now we're going to see just how far back there's clear evidence of a violent pattern.
The type that almost without exception will continue to escalate.
He already had an extensive criminal record, including a 1977 conviction in California
that involved a knife assault on a woman in a shopping center.
Cal served the minimum seven and a half year sentence for the Oregon attempted assault
conviction.
And he was released on parole from the Oregon State Penitentiary on March 25, 1991, after
receiving a favorable psychiatric evaluation.
He had been sentenced to 15 years after being convicted of first degree assault, but was
released after serving about half the time.
I hate that.
It's great.
I always hate that.
Fantastic, why? Following his release, Cal was placed under the supervision of a parole
officer, who specialized in the supervision of sex offenders. The parole officer was given
a letter from the district attorney who had prosecuted Brown on the dangerous offender
case. In the letter, the DA stated that not only did he consider Brown to be one of the
most dangerous criminals whom he had ever prosecuted, but also that, quote, "unless he is
undergone a remarkable transformation in prison, he will remain a potential mutilator and killer
of women." "Origin, girl, are you okay?" "Why'd they release him?" "I believe that people
can alter their paths in life, but I'm not sure that they ever really fundamentally change.
This is not the type of offender that should be released without an abundance of caution,
even at that early stage." "Yeah." "He's already proven that he is very dangerous."
"I just don't understand what, like even for good behavior, like, yeah, there's no women to
fucking murder in prison, so, of course, he's going to be all right." "Yeah, it seems like it."
During the first two months of his parole, Cal had enrolled as a student at Oregon State University
and met with his parole officer as required. And I'm sure everybody on the campus had no idea
which is horrifying. "That is gross." However, near the end of that period, his parole officer
could not get in touch with him. So it was on May 23rd of 1991 that his parole officer
requested that an arrest warrant be filed. It was on that very same day that Holly was
cajacked in the parking lot of the hotel near the Seattle Tacoma Airport.
"That's just crazy." "And just makes me so angry because this is like Richard Gilmore could be a very
parallel case to this." "Yeah." "He spent all of this time in prison and maybe now he decides that
what he doesn't want to do is leave witnesses." "Yeah."
Following his execution, the Walla Walla County coroner's office was scheduled to perform
an autopsy on Cal, Coburn Brown, who was 52 years old at the time of his execution.
Portland-based anti-death penalty attorney Jeff Ellis, who was a member of Brown's own defense team,
said, "There are many reasons to conclude that the one drug protocol lessons the risk of needless
pain and suffering." However, he said it obscures the basic issue of whether the state should be
in the business of killing. "As long as we have a death penalty, we must take measures to avoid
the needless inflection of pain on the person who is being killed." However, killing a human being
is never humane when we could instead lock him up forever. "You gotta keep him fucking locked up,
though." "Yeah." "No, I think I've expressed this in previous discussions on the show, and I know
I've mentioned it already at some point in the discussion about this case. Normally, I would not
consider myself a supporter of the death penalty, but I'll be honest, this is one autopsy that I don't
care if it shows the subject suffered." Not one bit. "No, not even a little."
"The tippy top of my pinky nail just doesn't care." "No."
I mean, it's a tough thing for me because I can't read the quote. However, killing a human being
is never humane when we could instead lock him up forever. "Yeah."
And there's a part of me that wants to agree with that sentiment until I remember
that Holly doesn't ever have the chance to do anything. "No." "Ever." "Not even eat."
"Nothing." "Like, this bitch got his last meal." "Yeah."
I know her family was very deeply upset that he wasn't put to death sooner.
"Well, I mean, they couldn't know either that the one drug thing would pop up. Like, he got his
stay in execution that way. "Right." "Yeah." "They don't know for how long."
"Yeah." "No, I mean, that's really valid. I think for them, that was a very upsetting time.
I do know that I've read about studies that show that whether you're a victim or a survivor of
the victim, studies have shown that oftentimes we think that capital punishment will give us relief.
It will give us a sense of peace, but they find that oftentimes it does not.
So that's a hard thing to grapple with, to think that you will be able to find some peace and
ultimately, Holly is no longer with her family. And that's something that we just, we can't write that.
So as complicated and I mean, just there's no other way to put it ethically complex as
issues surrounding this case are. I feel like it's time for us to get to something
that we enjoy and that I don't know. I'm hopeful that maybe there's something,
there's something good in a message that, you know, is going to come through in the cards and
that'll be for Holly. Yeah. We got this. Terror. Terror? Yeah. Terror?
All right. Should we do some terror? Yeah. Playing with fire over there.
I know. Well, I really wanted to make sure that they could see in the Patreon Terror video. You
guys, watch this. She's some practicing her shuffling. That was pretty good, right? That's respectable.
I'm probably the bridge. Yeah. I don't know how to do that. So nobody's going to be hiring me
at like a casino or anything, but like this is passable. Okay. Good job.
Hasey, I think we should both pick a card this time. We're going to do two cards. Yeah.
And a two-rollmist. I is promised. Ladies first. Oh my gosh. We just got this card the other day. Stop it.
Actually, you made a real of it, didn't you? I just posted a picture of it. Oh wait, no, I think you're
real. I did a real with the fire and stuff. Who knows? Fire? Yeah. Oh man, we were predicting the future
y'all. We even we drew it in reverse the other day. That is so fun. In our interview with Jeremy.
Yeah. From Age of Radio. She's like, wait, who, which day was that? Which day was that? Yeah.
Okay. I'm going to draw one. Oh, this is so precious looking.
Okay. I'm going to flip it so you can see it. Can you, can you, Vanna, why? Because my arms are two
T-rexie. Oh my gosh. Is that like a freaking
starlight? Favorite or something? I don't know what that little guy is. It's a little like weasel dude
stealing some eggs. It looks it does look like kind of a fox. I'm not sure if it's a weasel or
Oh, I guess so. I didn't say the card that I drew. I'm sorry. It's a seven of ones in reverse and I drew
and she drew the seven of sorts in reverse. Interesting. We both got seven cards. Interesting. Okay.
I'm looking up to see what our little critter is. Yeah. Oh, this sound's darling. He's an Olympic
short tailed weasel. Oh, it's a weasel. I said a weasel. He's cute. Oh my goodness. It is awfully cute.
And there's a really I won't read the interpretation because I feel like they're not as beneficial from
the P&W guidebook but yeah I'll get to it on the others. So I'm going to read Cassie's first.
It'll sound familiar if you were on the live. It's a mountain goat on the line. Okay. So seven of ones
in the reverse are keywords are courage fighting for what you believe in and facing challenges.
Interesting. Okay. The reversed seven of ones signifies a time of confusion. You can't decide
how to handle a challenge or which direction to take to accomplish your objective.
Lack of clarity may sap your willpower and make you feel like giving up. Wow. We've got a real
we got a dance and candle over here. Yeah. Yeah. In a reading about money, competitors or unexpected
expenses may cut into your financial resources. You may need to set firm guidelines for spending or
seek assistance from someone else. In a reading about work, the seven reversed cautions you to avoid
problematic people and watch your back. Don't get into arguments with co-workers, bosses or clients
now. Choose your battles carefully. And for love, this card indicates giving up on a relationship.
You feel worn down by problems and don't know how to settle your differences. Counseling could help
you gain clarity. Was that the one that was like the don't give up card? It is. It's kind of interesting
because it's like there was a lot of confusion and stuff about the or delays in the what I'm trying
to say. The death penalty. Yes. The state like don't give up. Yeah. He's still going to get it.
That is ultimately where my head went to. Interesting. So our seven of swords, keywords are uncertainty,
illusion, impetuousness, stealth, cunning and strategy. He was a weasel. I don't know how cunning he was.
Yeah. When the seven appears reversed, it can mean either you're behaving impetuously or that
you're overly cautious and afraid to act. It can also represent coming clean about a mistake
and trying to make restitution. Oh, he definitely came real clean real quick. Yeah. Wow.
And nothing about his statement rang as particularly genuine to me, but I think for a lot of people who
don't have normal people feelings, he probably thought that's what Holly's family wanted to hear
at the time of his execution. That or like coming clean about it. He was like, it's almost like he
should have saved that as his like bargaining chip. Yeah. But he just like spilled it out right away.
I don't know if he's expecting like, oh, honesty is going to save you a little bit here.
Sometimes this card shows you experimenting with different plans and getting various points of view.
Be focused and thorough in planning your strategy as Barbara Moore writes in the gilded tarot
companion. Be on guard or one of those swords left behind will find its way into his back.
Oh, vengeance. She is a tricky mistress. It is kind of interesting too because he was complaining about,
you know, being put to death and he didn't think he deserved it. Yeah. Yeah. But then it's like,
"Ha ha, you were put to death anyway." But then he was the last one. It's just like, it's kind of poetic
justice, I feel like. Yeah. It's like, it is. It's very strange to like put your finger on what the
right words are. In a reading about money, be careful of get rich quick schemes.
Like stealing money from people. Yeah, maybe gambling or dubious endeavors. Very dubious, very
aggravated mayhem. Yeah. Yeah. This is interesting. Sometimes it suggests you may have gained through
or are considering underhanded means. Yeah. If the reading is about your job, this card can warn
of dishonesty or deception in your workplace. Perhaps you'll need to separate yourself from a situation.
Stay open-minded and flexible so that you can respond to changes quickly. It can also mean
taking advantage of someone else. Yeah. In a reading about love, the reverse seven can mean
apologizing for a mistake or injury. Perhaps you've betrayed, hurt, or manipulated someone.
However, this card can also show you assisting a partner through a challenge or warning him or
her against a risky course of action. And there is an extra excerpt.
Tragedy should be utilized as a source of strength. No matter what source of difficulties,
how painful experiences, if we lose our hope, that's our real disaster.
Cassie, I feel like that was Holly. You're going to shit yourself. Why? That quote is from
his holiness, the 14th Dalai Lama. Oh, seven and seven. Interesting.
That was Holly for sure. Yeah. Remember at the end, you're like, maybe we'll get a reading for Holly.
And I was like, waiting for it. And I was like, I don't know. I don't feel it. I was even at,
for whatever reason, I was eyeballing this card and I kind of separated it. Do you think I should pull
it? Okay. So I don't know why I was feeling it needed to pull it. Pull it. But we're, we just do what we
want around here. So yeah, that's true. Okay. It's the King of Pentacles. King of Pentacles.
This big like, oh, that's such a pretty card. I really, really, I love this deck. This is so, so much.
Can't want to look up what kind of animal it is. It's an Olympic elk. Oh, it's a limbic. Yes. Yeah.
So King of Pentacles, our keywords are security, material success, pragmatism, stability,
strength, and worldly power. And this was upright. Yeah. Okay. Oh, wow. Okay. I just read the,
sorry, we took like a pause, but I read this whole thing and it was kind of interesting.
Okay. To read this. I want you to read yours because it's not making sense for me.
Okay. So this is the King march through his domain, treading lightly despite his bulk.
Was this, was he a bulky guy? He was a very large man. Interesting. Okay. I think that ended up not
making the cut in my notes, but he was quite large. Okay. Is my understanding. He walked slowly
that his subjects might better appreciate his flawless coat, his regal posture. Just picturing him
like walking around the airport. It's like, oh, I'm an architect. Mm-hmm. He carried his pride, his glory,
his ossified crown. I said that with a list. Wow. He's ossified. Awesome. You know, you didn't. You said
it. Find the first time. He lied. Yeah. ossified crown. He had devoted his life to reaching,
reaching this standing and he was comfortable in his defense of his territory. Everyone knew what was
his and none would try to take it. He understood this world well and he knew how to shape his role
to take advantage of it. How quickly it would all come crashing down when the plates shifted beneath
his hooves. Oh boy. Right. Yeah. It's like a, like a sign of vengeance. Yeah. Wow. It's almost like he,
he thought he could either get away with it or just like do it in a way to where he wouldn't
get put to death. Like I feel like his, I think that was because after skipping parole, like it seemed
like he did these things very quick and he did it to people very, it was like I'm almost like I know
I'm going to get caught. Like I want to get these things done. That sounds really bad. That's,
but it's a very good point. And I'm just looking at some pictures just to get an idea of size.
He's not a huge dude. That's not huge. He's not like, oh gosh, the last case that I covered from
out of Salem. Yeah. William Scott Smith. He's not quite that large, but he's like he thought he was.
Yeah. And of course, you know, compared to a relatively young and petite woman like Holly,
I'm sure he felt it. Well, interesting. Y'all got y'all all on. Y'all got three cards. Yeah.
We ready. I think we're ready. We're ready. We're supposed to stare at them like. Yeah.
How do we get two sevens in the 14 and then yeah, it's crazy. It's weird. I'm a witch.
because he's a witch. (chuckles)
- Have a creepy ass day. - Have a creepy ass day.
See you next Tuesday. - See you next Tuesday.
- Unless you're the last person
put to death in Washington.
- Yeah, and then you won't see us ever, ever, ever, ever, ever.
- Ever, ever, ever. (laughs)
- Ever again. - You never, ever, ever, ever.
- Bye. - Bye.
(laughs)
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- Bitchin.
(laughs)
(upbeat music)
- Based upon.
- Based upon?
- Yeah.
(laughs)
- Basting a cinne bomb.
(laughs)
- How do you base the cinne bomb?
Oh, you just take the goo.
The cinnamens stuffing, you just keep spraying more on top.
Just like a turkey.
- We should open a turquoise.
- Just like a turquoise called based upon.
- Oh, I love that for us.
- Oh my gosh.
- Based upon.
(laughs)
- Oh my God.