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Hello and welcome back to Communication Breakdown, a new podcast from the Observatory

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on Corporate Reputation.

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Thank you for joining us.

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I'm Steve Dowling in Silicon Valley.

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And I'm Craig Carroll in New York City.

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Each week we analyze how companies navigate the stories making headlines and how they

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sometimes fail to stay out of them.

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This week we turn to an unsettling and tragic story that is rock the corporate world, the

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shooting of UnitedHealthcare CEO, Brian Thompson in Midtown, Manhattan.

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Thompson, the leader of the country's largest health insurer, was murdered outside the

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company's annual investor meeting.

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While the public focused mostly on the week-long manhunt for Thompson's killer, the health

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insurance industry seemed to start taking security precautions, presumably for fear of

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copycat attacks.

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United Healthcare, Blue Cross Blue Shield and CVS, which owns HETNA, pulled the names and

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photos of its top executives from their website.

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In a statement following the shooting, United Healthcare said the company was "touched by

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the huge outpouring of kindness."

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But social media audiences were not so sympathetic.

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Mocking Thompson's murder, laughing at the company's post on Facebook, and railing against

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the corporate health care system.

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Andrew Whitty is the CEO of United Healthcare's parent company, United Health Group.

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He called Brian Thompson one of the good guys, who had a positive impact on American healthcare,

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and Whitty encouraged his 400,000 employees to tune out the negativity, which he said does

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not reflect reality.

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But he also laid out the company's mission in a way that drew out more criticism when his

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remarks were leaked to investigate reporter Ken Clippenstein.

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Our role is a critical role, and we make sure that care is safe, appropriate, and is delivered

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when people need it.

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And we guard against the pressures that exist for unsafe care or for unnecessary care to

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be delivered in a way which makes the whole system too complex and ultimately unsustainable.

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Craig, we cannot lose sight of the fact that this man was murdered in cold blood.

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His family and colleagues are grieving.

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I think that a lot of people, when they heard that an insurance executive had been attacked,

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immediately assumed that the motive was probably linked to discontent with our healthcare system

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here in the United States, something everyone is aware of and almost everyone has firsthand

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experience with, which is why Whitty's comments about unnecessary care landed poorly.

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But it's hard to think of another public figure whose death was met not just with cynicism,

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but apparently approval or at best in difference from so many commenters and not just on social

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media.

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So today we're going to talk about the crisis communications, both internal and external

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that we've seen in the wake of this terrible attack and also the changes we might see in

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the coming weeks and months, not just in the insurance industry, but possibly across corporate

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America.

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You're right, Steve.

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The lack of empathy here in the public reaction is chilling and really speaks to the

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disconnect between large companies, particularly in industries like healthcare and the general

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public.

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And it's almost as if the humanity of these leaders gets erased in the broader frustration

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with the systems that they represent.

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But this isn't just about public perception.

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It's also a challenge for corporate communicators.

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How do you craft a message that honors a tragedy like this while still addressing the underlying

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anchor that people are feeling towards your industry?

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And how do you do that without exacerbating the very divisions that can be putting your

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leadership at greater risk?

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This isn't just a PR issue.

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It's a reputational and operational crisis that's going to have long term implications for

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how companies and a number of contentious sectors apply or approach safety, transparency,

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and communication.

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Well, let's start with the operational part.

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We count on communications leaders to be cool headed in these moments, which means simultaneously

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dispassionate about the situation so they can make rational, well informed judgments,

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but also sensitive to the gravity and humanity of the moment to balancing that rational

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calculation with a real honest sense of compassion.

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Or if it helps, maybe you think of it in the reverse, you start from the compassionate

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point of view thinking about the victims.

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And you make sure you are able to check yourself from a more detached point of view.

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And honestly, I think in these situations, when and out, you air on the side of humanity

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and compassion.

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I think this is a challenging moment.

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I think it's one that has some potential to set presidents for public communications and

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other things tied to the business and the public and society at a greater scale here.

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For me, I know this moment requires empathy and humanity.

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And I can't just imagine what the Chief Comps Officer is discussing with the CEO either

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before the statement or during the statement or right after because this isn't to me just

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about the humanity in recognizing that the company needs a moment to grieve.

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You've still got to deal with the operational issues.

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I mean, the immediate pain of the family, yes, that's huge.

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The immediate pain of all the other employees and the people that are surrounding the CEO,

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yes.

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But at the same time, there's a lot of fear uncertainty and doubt among their customer base,

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among their partners, among their peers who are thinking, hey, maybe this could happen

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to us.

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And also at the same time, there's people that are just not going to be as human here and

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are thinking about it purely instrumentally in terms of what does this mean for the rest

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of the world?

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Yeah.

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I think that is what is remarkable, maybe unique, about this situation for United Health

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Care is is how they have had to navigate this really mean.

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I would say callous lack of sympathy from such a broad swath of the public, at least

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online, but also on television and in print, to make an announcement like they had to on

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social media, on Facebook and have 77,000 people click the laughing emoji.

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But there is no playbook for dealing with that.

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I read their statements and I wondered if they were trying to address it a little bit on day

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two, which was a more emotional message, thanking people as you mentioned for an outpouring

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of support.

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I think it was an attempt to find some light in the darkness that they really descended

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on this story because of this uncharted, I struggled to find the words for mocking anyone

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who is murdered like this.

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We live in this age of hot takes and it's not serving us well in situations like these.

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Right.

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Right.

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I think this is the part where we have to recognize that there are several things at play.

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Number one, this may not have been their channel choice to post something on Facebook.

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Right now, there is also a lot of concern about whether or not companies or the media should

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even be involved on Twitter or X.

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But the reality is people are there and audiences are there.

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Some of their customers might be there as well as all these antagonistic voices.

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You may not be speaking out, sharing your point of view, but you need to be aware of some

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of the people you care about are there and you need to be in tune with what they're thinking.

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Even with the grief right now, I think the dangerous part is that it would be very easy

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to either...

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I wouldn't say run and hide, but you are grieving and you're recognizing that there's

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a lot of callous voices out there and it's very easy to tune them out or to discount them

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for their callousness and their insensitivity.

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And I think as communicators, this is the part where we have to say, you know, look, we may

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not be responding then right now, but they are speaking and they're saying something antagonistic

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against our purpose, against our values, against what we're about and yet we're operating

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in the same public sphere here.

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We don't need to hear them out so that they feel better because now they've expressed their

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point of view.

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We need to know what their point of view is and we need to understand why they'd be willing

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to put aside their humanity to speak so outrageously here and let that tip over into such callousness.

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And okay, figure out, okay, what do we need to know that we maybe we weren't paying attention

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to or weren't aware of that is now more public?

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I think they took the right approach in focusing on their employees first in these situations.

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The internal audience has to get top priority.

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The CEO is almost always the highest profile person in the company, even if they don't know

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him, everybody knew of him, hopefully respected him, had a level of familiarity with him and

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those closest to him, whether it's 10 or a thousand people, they're grieving.

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They are feeling raw human emotion and that needs to be acknowledged.

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The loss needs to be acknowledged.

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So I agree with you taking notes to the extent that the industry needs reinforcing as to why

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customers and the general public are frustrated with them.

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But I also think that in a situation like this, everybody needs to recognize that we're

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in a window, a time window where there really, there aren't any appropriate comments except

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about the tragedy and the people who are affected by it.

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And maybe now, a week later, maybe that window is starting to open or starting to close

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rather that it could be the time to start talking about broader issues.

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But I don't feel it.

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And especially since there has been so much negativity.

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I think honestly, the people who would have really benefited from taking a pause are the

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critics.

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The hours and days immediately following an incident like this, which are filled with grief

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and emotion, that is not the time.

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And some really high profile people got caught up in this saying things like violence isn't

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the answer, but people can only be pushed so far.

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And those comments were walked back.

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But people, they're getting caught up in the moment.

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And we should point out that this was Senator Elizabeth Warren who made that answer patient,

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that's what's significant about this comment.

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She later just said there's never justification for murder, violence is never the answer

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period.

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So people know this.

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They're just getting caught up in it.

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And that's why I think it's important to have just that little bit of detachment, as a

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comms leader when you're calling the shots or giving advice.

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It's a balance that we again, we count on, comms leaders to make.

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Yeah, but here's the thing.

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Even though I agree to you that there is this window and now is not the time, nevertheless,

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here antagonists took advantage of that window and they inserted themselves in.

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And even though the dust may settle a week from now and then we can calmly respond to these

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things here, the reality is for most of the public, they will have already moved on.

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And they're going to remember seeing and hearing what what your critics had to say.

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So part of it here is, yeah, okay, they're not responding fairly.

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And it's very true that the industry probably knows everything that they're saying.

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They don't need to respond.

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Everything that they're saying during this window, yeah, been there done that.

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We've heard all these critiques before, but it's very possible that for the larger public

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that this is a moment where they are becoming a little bit more aware.

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So it's it, you know, it presents the situation to where for the public for other audiences

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that are, you know, they really don't have a dog in this hunt, right?

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They're really not paying attention.

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They saw a CEO was shot, murdered on the streets in New York, right?

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And then they're hearing the repressed reports about the degree of pushback on social media,

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countering the company.

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So now there's two greater voices out there.

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And you know, that's part of news is the reporting of controversy.

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But now the public has two major voices out there, the company and these critics.

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I'll make the strategic argument, which I feel a bit callous doing, but here you have an

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industry that is under attack for being insensitive to human needs, to human emotions,

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to people's health.

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And in this moment, I think it makes sense to stay focused on the humanity to do that.

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But I was saying earlier, default to the compassionate position because I would never suggest that

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it be used opportunistically.

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But if you are in an industry that is being criticized for being inhumane, showing your

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humanity is not a bad thing.

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Yeah.

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So let's circle back to the league statement from the CEO, right?

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Where he then addresses these critics.

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How then do you respond as a communicator knowing that your CEO has made a statement that

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we even though it's leaked, it's now out there in the public discourse.

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And now you're having your respond to a statement that both touches on the humanity of the

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situation, but also might be perceived as a little callous tenant of itself.

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Well, this is, I think this sort of reinforces my point because he said a lot of things in

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that statement to employees of video, which was leaked.

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It was not intended for external consumption.

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That's another thing that we should probably reinforce.

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But he said a lot of things in there about Thompson, very complimentary things, but the thing

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that the critics, that the external audience and I would suggest the press were primed

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to pick up on was his defense of their business model effectively.

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And so I think that that again shows that this is like now is not the time to be talking

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about this.

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There is this old saying.

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There's a time and place for that.

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And you know, it's not a time or place for two things.

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One, this calling out your critics and two, talking about your business models.

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That fair?

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Yeah, I think engaging on that topic is not only insensitive to the grieving family and

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employees who have just lost their leader, but it's clearly not a winning message is not

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something that the public is looking to be sympathetic to you about it.

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I'm not saying that that's what he was looking for, but as it's presented, the first thing

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that people pick up on is the way he phrased it, preventing unnecessary care or whatever.

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That type of messaging just is not a good look in this moment.

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Yeah.

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So there's so many different directions to go with this from here, right?

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But let's start off with what are the implications here for other companies and what are some

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of the adjustments that you see that other companies will likely make at this point?

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Well, I think tighter security is going to be a given.

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I think the other issue in the future as you're pointing out is it's going to be interesting

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to see if the industry starts to change how it's communicating with customers, the healthcare

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industry, communicating with customers and the public about its role.

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And I know we talked about this earlier, but pulling the names of executives off the website

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and taking the pictures down.

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But that's a knee jerk response that we understand why a company would do that.

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Just as there were security alerts, I think at the headquarters of the company, those are

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either going to have to go back up in a different way or companies are going to have to figure

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out how they are presenting themselves to the public while balancing the security risk.

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I think the two things that we've got to be concerned with tied to the knee jerk response

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is maybe over responding or maybe even pushing the narrative further about the divide between

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senior level leadership and your employee base when they see you taking so much, so many

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precautions, so much expense for the senior leadership team, right?

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I think it just further pushes that narrative of the divide between employees and customers.

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And to the other about the websites, yeah, look, the photos have got to go back up there,

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you know, and we've already seen so many other companies that have started to take their

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photos down.

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But you know, the thing is that does affect transparency to small signal, but it is a,

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it's a behavioral indicator that that matters and these small things affect perceptions of

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equity or perceptions of, you know, caring for your employees as much as you do for your

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senior leadership and also just basic perceptions of transparency.

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Well, and especially in this industry, which deals with people's health, deals with people's

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lives, you want to, you want to make sure people know that you care for lack of a better

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term like you and maybe that sounds right, but what better way to demonstrate than by showing

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that your company is run by humans.

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You know that if you're taking the names and faces of people off the website, I'm not saying,

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I'm reluctant to find fault or take issue with any of these decisions that they made in

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the immediate aftermath.

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But as a long term proposition, it just, you're right, it's not sustainable to not show the

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human beings behind this company that deals with decisions of life and death.

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It's hard to predict what the messaging decisions will be, but I would not be surprised

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at some point in the not too distant future for the industry to try to take a different

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tack.

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But it's going to be hard to make that impactful if you still have, you know, lots of people

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who are coming away from experiences, feeling like they or their loved ones were denied

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coverage for procedures that they expected, you know, to be taken care of by their ensure,

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to whom they play.

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But pay premiums every month.

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To your point earlier, there are operational factors here that go well beyond communications,

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but I'm sure that there will be communications efforts and it will be really interesting

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to see how the industry approaches that.

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There's a few things here that I see out of this for other companies.

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Number one is, I think the danger of being too narrow and how you think about your stakeholders

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or the groups that matter to you and the groups that you matter to them, right?

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This is not just about customers, it's not just about your employees, it's not just about

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your supply chain or the communities where your employees work.

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Right now, in real time, they are getting a taste of the wider range of voices that are

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paying attention.

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This is the story now of national significance and we have so many harsh voices out there

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and we've already addressed them.

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But people who may not be paying attention anymore to the tonality or to the criticisms

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might remember some of the points, right?

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Even though Senator Elizabeth Warren walked back her statement and recognized as that

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was a little harsh, I don't think her policies are going to change.

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I think being aware of the policy implications for healthcare in this country or for the fairness

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and for this case, being held up as a case study or a lightning ride for other things for

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the discontent between main street and wall street, if you will.

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Yeah, my main takeaway for comms leaders, comms practitioners at any level is that a situation

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like this in any situation, but especially in a crisis.

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The comms team, the first instinct is to project stability, continuity, whose successor,

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reassure people, any operational disruption will be minimal.

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But all those messages of themselves are tone deaf in the face of someone's tragic deaf

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murder.

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So there needs to be this balance I was mentioning earlier and you need to make sure you're

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messaging with humanity, we're all human, we can all understand hopefully intuitively,

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but if not, then maybe with a little nudge to remind us that there's an impact here that

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goes beyond business.

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So my my high level take on this is don't rush or don't be afraid to pause to collect your

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thoughts and really read the room usually a little extra time costs you nothing, especially

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if you are at the center of it, the press and the public they're waiting for you and they

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will wait if you stretch it too long, you may pay a price, but in general, I think as a rule

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of thumb, you probably have more time than you think and that that defaulting to the sympathetic,

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compassionate human voice tone point of view is the right way to go.

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You said two things that are really important one is the balance and two is the recognizing

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that you don't have to do everything right now, the timing, the timing of it says like we

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need to put first things first, we got to make sure your exercise here is balanced and

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moderate and you're giving proper attention to both at the same time and not one at the

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expense of the other.

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I'm with you except let's just broaden our definition of of at the same time because

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as I said earlier, I think there is a there is a window and you have to navigate by feel

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on this.

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Yeah, but there is a window in which I think as a company, you really don't have an obligation

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to address any of that criticism certainly not this strident and call us.

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Okay, that's the part I want to explore right because it's not about the addressing, I

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agree.

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This is not the time to be speaking and challenging them.

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Well, whether it's direct or indirect, I'm just saying as a topic, I think, but over

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over time, I think you're right that you do need to balance these things out, but there

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will be a time and place for that debate over the role of insurers and whether their

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profits are too great or whether they're treating people with sufficient compassion, but

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I would argue that now is not the time.

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I'm going to push back just a little here, right?

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Because I understand you don't need to respond to them.

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You don't need to address or concerns now and that's not the time for you to be speaking,

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but operationally, communicatively, this is the time to still be listening and that's

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the part.

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Well, for sure.

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No, no, absolutely.

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And that I think is part of the sort of dispassionate, rational point of view that we depend

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on communications leaders to play, but I think it's in, you're in listening and collecting

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mode right now and then you have time to make decisions about how you're going to address

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that indirectly, directly, communications, operational policy, whatever it's going to

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be.

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But I again, go back to now is not the moment to make those decisions.

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Well, not the moment to make the decisions, not the moment to address.

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There are some decisions you do have to make sure with just the listening side that you

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stay at the table, you know, you may not be responding to them, but you need to be cataloging

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their thoughts and being prepared to respond later.

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That part, you can't decide to do that later because once the moment's gone, it's too late.

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Everybody, it'll already be a part of the psyche of everyone else is paying attention and

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it may not be the moment that you care to respond at that moment.

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It may not be in your top five, but you will have to recognize it was in the top five

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or everyone else.

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You've heard it even if you weren't paying attention to it, but I want to circle back on

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the balance metaphor a little bit more.

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So the idea of the strength training here and dealing with both a communicational and

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operational at the same time is to say true.

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We won't be engaging from a messaging perspective, but communicatingively, we will be responding

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from a listening perspective and being aware of what's going on.

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But here's the opportunity, I would say we have now, Steve, is that we're so focused

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on talking points and understanding the issues and having our point of view out there and

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getting people on board with our point of view.

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The opportunity that I see here from an operational standpoint is to make better communication

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channels for listening throughout the organization.

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I don't mean just to your employee base, but getting all of the connecting the pipes across

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the different functions of the business to make sure that whatever intel that they're

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gathering, whatever voice is that they're hearing from, that we might not normally have

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caught, but we know that material is coming in.

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I know it's already information overload, but the timing is such that from a crisis

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planning perspective, from a resilience perspective and preparing for the future, there's a lot

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coming at you and anything that you can do to improve your ability to capture it and

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even if you're responding later.

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I of course think that data collection throughout this is important.

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I just, I'm making an assumption here, but I feel pretty confident in making it.

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The complaints and the criticisms are not going to be news to these companies.

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They've got to be aware because they've heard it before.

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I think what makes this moment powerful in a very unfortunate way is that it seems to

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be a galvanizing moment for the critics and where that goes, we don't know.

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It is a galvanizing moment.

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It's a lot stronger now, but the part that the danger of just relying purely on tonality

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of been there done that hurt at all before is that right now there are ripple effects.

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Right now it is a cascading through other networks.

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It's cascading through other sectors of your stakeholder base through your communities

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and through Washington, through your supply chains of being aware of the degree that it

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is galvanized right now.

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I think the danger is recognizing when you start to have new voices at the table to the point

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that it can affect future safety, the legitimacy or the relationships that your company has,

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both among its customer base, but also with Washington.

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But also I'm going to say from a generational perspective of like being a fair and responsive

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corporate citizen in this country.

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The question I guess then is does this galvanized anger actually advance the cause of the critics?

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I'm not entirely sure that it does.

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If there's a benefit, if you will, to the critics, it's just awareness.

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It's just an awareness that people who are frustrated with insurance companies are not alone

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and that it could possibly draw them together.

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It's hard for me to get away from the notion that a lot of this is happening for the wrong

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reasons and that's because a man was killed.

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You know what I'm curious about, Steve, is why in light of companies speaking out on

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so many other social issues, why companies are not speaking out about the instability of

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the moment?

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I think that it's entirely appropriate.

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It's interesting to look at the other voices.

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You set aside United Health Care.

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They're dealing with grief.

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But would it be appropriate for others to say this is not the way we're going to settle

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our disputes?

387
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I think that would be a really good approach.

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Again, there's got to be some indication that it's genuine and that there is a willingness

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to hear people out and at least explain in a more human sense and show the benefit that

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these companies feel they bring, which Witty was trying to do.

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He told his team to be proud of what they do.

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I think this is to a point we just touched on briefly earlier.

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It's most powerful when you can say the same thing internally as externally.

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I think for Witty, that would have meant maybe moderating the comments about unnecessary care

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or whatever and being a little more considered on the value that they believe the company

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brings.

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I know we're close to the time here.

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I just want to think about some other things that we could add here.

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I'm just wrapping up, being very clear about things that companies could be doing or learning

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from this moment or what many of them are already doing.

401
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We know that many are putting a focus right now on heightened security protocols and whether

402
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it's increased security offices or shareholder events.

403
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That's certainly real.

404
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I think it closing.

405
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I don't know.

406
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I just think we're going to be looking at in the future is this going to be held as a

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case for or an exemplar for how we think about just segments of society having a growing

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distrust in corporate institutions, particularly in industries like healthcare.

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The second thing is just understanding what are the potential, cultural and societal implications

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here?

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I mean, one thing I can already see just in terms of the voices that have played out on

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social media and news reporting with these other voices is that this is eventually

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going to be a case study on the further divide between Wall Street and Main Street and the

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divide between senior level management and the rank and file of their employee base.

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Is a really difficult topic.

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It's going to take some interesting turns.

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I think we both have a lot of sympathy for everybody that's affected in this story this

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week and appreciate the conversation.

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That is our show for this week.

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We want to thank Sean P. Neal and the people forward network for making our podcast possible.

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If you'd like to tell us what you think or if you have a topic you'd like to suggest

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for our show, we would love to hear from you.

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Our email address is podcast@ocrnetwork.com.

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Communication breakdown is a production of the Observatory on corporate reputation.

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I'm Steve Dowling and I'm Greg Carroll.

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Thanks for listening.

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We'll be back next week.

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